Game Recap: An awful defensive showing leads to second straight loss
After an embarrassing 34-20 loss to Tampa Bay, it seems like the Packers are back to their old 2023 ways.
By GregMeinholz
That's certainly not how I expected this game to go, but when I think about it, I really cannot be shocked. We talk week in and week out about how this Packers' defense continually gets gashed in the running game. Well, they held the Buccaneers to only 99 rushing yards. Great right? Not really. Instead of getting gashed by the run, the Packers decided to get completely carved up by Baker Mayfield for 381 yards passing and four touchdowns. Something that continues to frustrate me relentlessly with this defense is how we have our linebackers lined up to cover the opposition's best receivers man-to-man. Tell me, in what realm are DeVondre Campbell or Preston Smith going to shut down Mike Evans or Chris Godwin? The chances of that are slim. This game was just out of control as soon as we were watching Tampa Bay recover from sacks or penalties with ease, and the icing on the cake for me may have been the easy 24-yard catch on 2nd and 29 to put the Buccaneers back in scoring possession at the end of the first half. That simply cannot happen.
The offense undoubtedly had their struggles as well, so this one isn't completely on the defense. Jordan Love still had a relatively decent game going 29/39 for 284 yards and 2 touchdowns. However, he had some easy throws that he should've been able to put on the money that would've perhaps made this a different game earlier. He recovered with a few dart throws later, which is nice to see for his future progression, but alas it does nothing for today's match-up. Welcome back Aaron Jones, we would've liked to see more of you though. Jones got off to a great start returning from injury and helped get the offense in scoring position. Unfortunately, it seemed like as the Packers began playing from behind, Jones became an afterthought. Dontayvion Wicks and Tucker Kraft again shined in this game though, so we have a little bit to build on heading to the next one in that regard.
Let's get to the recap:
First Quarter:
The Buccaneers received the opening kickoff after the Packers deferred to halftime and would start their first drive from their own 25-yard line after calling for a fair catch on the kick. In three plays they marched straight into Packer's territory following a 24-yard pass to Rachaad White down to the Packers’ 37-yard line. The Packers' defense had a chance to get off the field forcing a 3rd down and 4 but Chris Godwin was able to get free easily on a first down catch of 12 yards from Baker Mayfield into the red zone at the Packers’ 19-yard line. The defense forced a 3rd down attempt again and this time Mayfield met Rashan Gary, Kenny Clark, and TJ Slaton as Mayfield was sacked for a loss of 6. Clark would be credited for the sack. The Bucs would have to settle for 3 as Chase McLaughlin would put Tampa Bay up 3-0 with 9:02 remaining in the 1st quarter. A typical bend don’t break drive for the Packers’ defense on that drive, but we’d like to see them give the Bucs offense a little more pushback before they get into the red zone.
After the kickoff, the Packers would start their first drive of the game at their own 25-yard line. They got off to a good start with a 7-yard pass to Romeo Doubs before Aaron Jones would take a 20-yard carry to the Tampa Bay 48-yard line on his first carry since being inactive the last few games. After two straight runs by Jones went for only 4 yards, Jordan Love then hit Jayden Reed to the left for a 20-yard gain down to the Tampa Bay 24-yard line. After four straight Jones runs for a total of 21 yards Aaron Jones would be stuffed in the backfield on third down on yet another run. Matt LaFleur would keep the offense on the field and on fourth down Love would miss Jayden Reed on an out-route in the end zone turning the ball over on downs.
The Bucs would take over at their own 4-yard line with 2:25 remaining in the 1st quarter. Two plays in, Kingsley Enagbare would force a Baker Mayfield fumble giving the Packers first and goal at the Tampa 4-yard line.
The Packers would take over inside the five and on second down Jordan Love would hit Tucker Kraft on a short route who would tumble behind a few offensive linemen into the endzone for the Packers’ touchdown. The Packers would take the lead 7-3 with 0:49 remaining in the first quarter.
The Buccaneers got off two runs for 13 yards to start their third drive before the end of the 1st quarter.
Second Quarter:
To start the second quarter Baker Mayfield hit on two straight passes one to Mike Evans and the other to Chris Godwin totaling 39 yards down to the Packers’ 23-yard line. Two plays later Mayfield easily hit Mike Evans for a 19-yard touchdown beating Eric Stokes up the middle for the score. Following the extra point, the Bucs would take the 10-7 lead with 12:21 remaining in the half.
The Packers would take over at their own 25-yard line after the kickoff and on first down Jordan Love would be sacked by Nelson for a loss of 2. Seemingly a coverage sack as Love had plenty of time to throw but couldn’t find a receiver. Two plays later Love would catch the Buccaneers on a neutral zone infraction bringing third down to only 3rd and 2 where Tucker Kraft would catch a Love pass to the left for 8 yards converting the first down. Kraft wasn’t done after that as Jordan Love would find him again for a 36-yard catch down to the TB 23-yard line. After the catch, Kenyan Drake would get his first carry of the game nearly fumbling the ball before being tackled for no gain. Unfortunately, the Packers drive would stall after two short passes couldn’t convert and Anders Carlson would split the uprights to tie the game at 10-a-piece with 7:09 remaining in the half.
After yet another fair catch on the kickoff, Tampa would take over at their own 25 to start the drive. On the first play of the drive, Hainsey would be called for a false start pushing the Bucs backward right off the bat. They would get the penalty yards back but wouldn’t overcome the rest of the distance going three and out after Mayfield was hit as he threw causing the ball to float incomplete. After a huge punt by Bucs punter Camarda went for 65 yards, the Packers would be pinned deep at their own 4-yard line to start the next drive.
Taking over with 5:31 left in the first half, Jordan Love sailed a pass for Jayden Reed under pressure, Reed was hit by the defender before the ball got there so DPI was called taking the Packers out of the shadow of their own goalpost to the 36-yard line. Love would hit Doubs for 11 yards but that would be the only positive afterward as short gains and a delay of game would line up the Packers for a 4th and 6 attempt however it would seem the Packers would only attempt to draw Tampa Bay offsides before taking the delay of game call and punting the ball away on fourth down.
Tampa Bay would start their next drive at their own 11-yard line with 2:13 remaining in the first half. After the two-minute warning, the Buccaneers would get moving. In four passes Mayfield would get the Bucs down to the Packers’ 33-yard line before Lukas Van Ness would sack Mayfield for a loss of 9. A holding call would be made on 3rd down pushing Tampa even further back to the TB 48-yard line. On 2nd and 29 though Mayfield would hit Chris Godwin for 24 yards to the Packers’ 28-yard line. An absolutely pathetic showing for the Packers' defense on that play to let Tampa right back into field goal range after knocking them out previously. Afterward on 3rd and 5 Mayfield would sail a ball out of bounds leading to a Chase McGaughlin 46-yard field goal attempt that he would drill right through taking the score 13-10 with 10 seconds remaining in the half.
After a Keisean Nixon kickoff return to the 25-yard line, Jordan Love would kneel the ball to take the game to halftime where the Packers would receive the kick to start the 2nd half.
Third Quarter:
Receiving the ball to start the second half, the Packers would begin the drive at their own 25-yard line after the touchback. The Packers’ offense would, unfortunately, go three and out after Jayden Reed and Dontayvion Wicks seemed to run the same route on third down and the ball sailed incomplete. Not a good start for the Packers’ offense in the second half when they needed to get off to a good start. Probably the only positive for the Packers on that drive was they forced the Bucs to take a timeout after trying to catch them in the middle of a substitution.
After the punt, the Bucs offense would take over from their own 34-yard line with 14:21 remaining in the 3rd. The Packers forced a third down early, but Baker Mayfield came up with a big 18-yard pass to Mike Evans for the first down. TJ Slaton disrupted a rush attempt on 1st down that Campbell buried for a loss and then after an incompletion on second the Bucs would again convert with a 15-yard pass to Chris Godwin down to the Packers' 31-yard line and two plays later Mayfield would hit Rachaad White on a 26-yard uncontested touchdown pass. Again, the defense is easily burned through the air letting Tampa Bay go seemingly uncontested for six. Tampa Bay would go up 20-10 with 10:55 remaining in the third quarter.
The Packers would take over for their second drive of the second half and would get their first 1st down of the half off a Dontayvion Wicks 22-yard catch to the TB 48-yard line. A second pass to Wicks for five yards would seemingly be incomplete as the ball was dropped before he really took any steps but the officials would call it a fumble recovered by GB for only a gain of 2. Two plays later Love would hit Wicks again for a 21-yard gain to the TB 25. The Packers would go backward though on a holding call on Josh Myers but the Packers would overcome that call with a great catch by Malik Heath for 15-yards and then Love would hit Bo Melton for a first down to the TB 13-yard line. The Packers had a string of frustrating checkdowns following this but on 3rd and 14, Jordan Love hit Jayden Reed with a dart in the corner of the endzone where Reed would tap two feet down for the 17-yard touchdown catch. An outstanding throw by Love after some frustrating luck in the previous two plays. The Packers take the score to 20-17 with 4:18 remaining in the 3rd quarter.
Taking over at their own 25-yard line Mayfield hit Cade Otton immediately for a 22-yard gain to the 47-yard line before Kenny Clark got to Baker Mayfield on an 8-yard sack. Unfortunately, in true fashion in this game, the defense would give up a 21-yard catch to Chris Godwin the very next play eliminating the sack. The defense had a shot to get off the field on third down a few plays later but Corey Ballentine would be called for DPI against Mike Evans resulting in a first down to the Packers’ 38-yard line. Evans was going for the call the whole way and was handed it. Two plays later Mayfield hits Cade Otton for 22 yards down to the Packers’ 2-yard line. Mayfield would then hit Ko Kieft for a two-yard touchdown to put Tampa Bay back up by 10 taking the score to 27-17 with 0:20 remaining in the 3rd. The defense once again just gets ripped apart by Mayfield and I can’t help but wonder why they even try as there doesn’t seem to be a difference between them on the field or not on passing plays.
The Packers took over at their own 25 again after the touchback. A four-yard pass to Jayden Reed would end the third quarter.
Fourth Quarter:
Starting the fourth quarter with 2nd and 6, Love would hit Dontayvion Wicks on a short route that Wicks would take 20 yards to the GB 49-yard line. Love would hit Wicks again on first down for 19 yards to the TB 32 where the offense would get cooking. Two plays later Aaron Jones would take a catch five yards for the first down, but the official would spot Jones short by a full yard. Matt LaFleur would challenge the play and the play would stand. On third down though Jordan Love would pick up the first down on a sneak up the middle. Unfortunately, this would be about as far as the Packers would get as three plays later, they’d have to settle for three on an Anders Carlson field goal. The score would move to 27-20 with 10:04 remaining and the game goes back in the hands of a defense that has struggled terribly.
The Buccaneers would take over at their 25 and a Mayfield rush for no gain and a White rush for 6 would lead to 3rd and 4 where of course Mayfield would hit Chris Godwin for 11 yards and the first down. What else would happen? A stop? Not today for this defense. The Bucs faced 3rd and 4 again and guess what? The defense would give up a 52-yard touchdown pass to David Moore. It was a short pass, but Moore easily took it the distance. The play was reviewed afterward as Rudy Ford had knocked the ball out of Moore’s hands close to the goal line, but the touchdown would stand taking the score to 34-20 Tampa Bay with 6:30 remaining in the game.
The Packers would begin their next drive at their own 22-yard line. Love would hit Doubs for a quick first down and the Packers’ offense would run an up-tempo offense taking the ball down to the TB 30-yard line in four plays after, highlighted by a 13-yard catch by Dontayvion Wicks. The drive would stall from here but the Packers would go for it on fourth down where Jordan Love would be sacked by Shaq Barrett and he would fumble the ball recovered by Tampa Bay.
TB would take over at the Green Bay 49 with 4:18 remaining in the game. Tampa would then force the Packers to take their two remaining timeouts as the clock ran. The defense would hold the Tampa offense to 4th and 2 but Tampa would go for it and easily convert to essentially put this game out of reach. After this on second down Rachaad White would take a run 22 yards before giving himself up at the Green Bay 11-yard line where after two kneel downs this game would be over.
The Packers record would drop to 6-8 after a 34-20 loss to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers.
Offensive Player of the Game:
I'm giving the Offensive Player of the Game award to Dontayvion Wicks. Wicks had six catches for 97 yards on seven targets. Wicks seemed to be Jordan Love's security blanket in this game coming up with big plays left and right. He has a fumble on the stat sheet but I truly debate that call as it seemed he barely took a step before the ball came out. A game after a catch and three feet in the end zone before a drop was called incomplete, suddenly a catch, turn around and drop is a fumble. I'm begging the NFL to make it make sense, but we know they never will. I'll go to the grave before I ever find out what an NFL catch truly is.
Defensive Player of the Game:
I'm going to give this one to Kenny Clark. Clark had two sacks, two tackles for loss, one pass deflection, and two QB hits. This was a good game for Clark as he was very disruptive in the middle of the defensive line. I have to give an honorable mention to Kingsley Enagbare for his sack-fumble early in the game that set up a Packers touchdown. If not for that play, this game could've gotten out of hand quickly.
What Went Right:
Dontayvion Wicks started this season as the number 4 receiver. Tucker Kraft as the number 2, sometimes the number 3 tight end. No one saw these guys being factors this season, but Wicks and Kraft were the top receivers in this game. If anything it gives them a push moving forward.
Lukas Van Ness had a good game today. He registered 4 total tackles, one sack, a tackle for loss, and a QB hit. The name of the game with him is progress progress progress. Any steps forward are good to see with him in his development to hopefully become a force of nature on the defense.
TJ Slaton also showed out with some disruption on the defensive line, hopefully, we get more of that moving forward.
What Went Wrong:
Passing defense. This secondary or pass defense as a whole was atrocious today. When I start having zero confidence in this defense to get a stop, you know it's bad. 2nd and 18 conversions, 2nd and 29 24-yard gains, just horrendous. A defense that was able to put Patrick Mahomes in his place just got absolutely picked apart by Baker Mayfield. That can't be a story if you want to have a good season.
Lack of Aaron Jones later. We heard Jones would be on a snap count but that didn't seem to be the case early. Unless they meant nothing but Jones early and next to nothing later. I get it that we were playing from behind, but we have to find ways to get our most dynamic offensive weapon the ball whenever possible.
Looking Forward:
Moving ahead to next week, after two straight seasons playing on Christmas day, the Packers are set to kick off before Santa makes his rounds on Christmas Eve. The Pack will be in Charlotte for a noon match-up against the Carolina Panthers. The Panthers, after making a big trade to select Bryce Young with the first overall pick in the 2023 draft, have had nothing but despair this season alongside the mid-season firing of their head coach, Frank Reich. Normally we shouldn't care about that right? Tough luck huh? Unfortunately, this means the Bears hold the first overall pick in the 2024 draft as the Panthers traded their 2024 pick to the Bears to acquire Bryce Young. So, the Panthers are the worst team in the league right now. This gives the Bears the first overall pick in the draft if the Panthers' despair continues. Naturally, as a Packer fan, you kind of hope the Panthers do better so maybe the Bears don't get that pick. But not this time, hopefully, their misfortune will give the Packers an easy win on Christmas Eve so we may all enjoy the holiday. Until that time comes, Go Pack Go.
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Greg Meinholz is a lifelong devoted Packer fan. A contributor to CheeseheadTV as well as PackersTalk. Follow him on Twitter @gmeinholz for Packers commentary, random humor, beer endorsements, and occasional Star Wars and Marvel ramblings.
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Comments (126)
Rhah
December 17, 2023 at 03:54 pm
Fire Barry!
stockholder
December 17, 2023 at 04:03 pm
Got to keep him 2 more weeks.
A 7-10 record keeps us at pick 15.
A 8 - 9 record puts us at 25 ^.
jjbathgate66
December 17, 2023 at 04:27 pm
They left their brains and balls in the locker room, easiest schedule down the stretch and this is how they play. Guys are always having career games against the pack. 7-10 cause the rest won't lay down this this group.
Doofapotamus
December 17, 2023 at 05:19 pm
What boggles my mind is that every week, seemingly, someone is getting their first NFL touchdown, or their first touchdown in 4 years, or something along those lines. It's amazing
Fubared
December 17, 2023 at 06:49 pm
You mean like van ness getting a sack and going off the field to sit.. they play this favorite game to appease gutt. Van ness has to be developed and thus used sparingly so higher priced guys play first.
Doofapotamus
December 17, 2023 at 11:23 pm
No, I mean the undrafted FA tight end from (insert college name here) starting his first NFL game gets a touchdown. The receiver who hasn't caught a pass in two years and was elevated from the practice squad the morning of catches a huge pass for a big gain. Our defense is allowing guys; who normally don't make an impact; to alter the end result of the game substantially.
cpabandit
December 17, 2023 at 05:35 pm
They left their "brains"??? What are you talking about? How can you say that? They have no brains! They are totally ignorant and undisciplined. Stupid penalties, running wrong routes, tackling with their ass, on and on.
Green Bay Shareholder
December 17, 2023 at 07:47 pm
They know where to deposit their game checks though !
KenEllis
December 17, 2023 at 03:55 pm
Always better to see a coach, President, and GM a year longer than get rid of him at the right time.
Joe B will be gone after the 2023 season, Muprh after the 2024 season, and Gute after 2025 season.
Go Pack Go.
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 05:05 pm
And MLF? … stays????
jyros
December 17, 2023 at 04:01 pm
Can we PLEASE move on from Joe Barry now?!🙏
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 05:06 pm
“Now is not the time”
Matt LeFleur answers the question should Joe Barry be fired.
Lol.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 12:59 am
I don't understand the downvotes, it's exactly what MLF said. And it's all he said on that topic.
So he's telling us there's a chance? Lol
Packerpasty
December 17, 2023 at 04:06 pm
for a few years now other teams consider the Packers as "soft"...nothing is changing, bring in a coaching staff that will have them playing hard and being thought of as a tough out....go hire Schwartz give him some big bucks to come over...at least he'll be fired up on the sidelines maybe his players wil do the same...and Love cant be a .500 QB, a few amazing throws, a few lucky throws and a bunch of bad throws...still needs lots of work but will anything change?? Been coached for awhile now should be learning footwork at least...lets hope for the Packers sake he's got it all together next season...no more excuses next year...
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 05:00 pm
Sorry if MLF is back it doesn’t matter. Moses could come down off the mountain to coach the defense.. doesn’t matter.
MLF is simply not the right guy for this job. After 85 games, he has let you know what he is. And it’s not worth keeping
LeotisHarris
December 17, 2023 at 07:09 pm
"Moses could come down off the mountain to coach the defense.. "
I've only heard stories (stockholder was around back then, he may recall), but I think Moses D schemes had trouble with at least nine of the 12 Tribes in the League, especially Gad, Judah, and Zebulun. Who knows, he may have changed. Might be better off with someone with a more current resume. Then again, that whole Red Sea thing was pretty impressive.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 01:01 am
Gad is a tough out. They leap over a wall and run through a troop!
aberk
December 17, 2023 at 06:32 pm
I agree with you Packer patsy. J love is not a leader, makes too many basic mistakes...they should draft another QB just in case.
And get rid of Joe Barry. Please take him away!
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 10:20 pm
Actually Joe Barry has employed Moses’ Red Sea defense a few times.
Fubared
December 17, 2023 at 07:00 pm
I say they don't want a top notch d coach. Whomever that is they would raise holy hell: Alexander wont tackle is a powder puff. Nixon couldn't out run a 60 year old with a head start, Stokes is the finest fucked up over priced corner in football. Linebackers cant cover they lack serious side to side speed. No that person would want to gut this defense and start over.
Management cant afford to spend the bucks on that.
jannesbjornson
December 17, 2023 at 07:02 pm
Love still has to show these last three episodes. If he's still shaky, they could move on a QB. From not suiting him up in 2019, until his debut, he's been mis-managed.
4thand1
December 17, 2023 at 04:07 pm
fuck, fuck
NJ-RICK
December 17, 2023 at 04:08 pm
Get rid of front office MGT... Poor drafting, lack of veteran free agents and the team is in salary cap hell for the next two seasons. It all starts at the top... Murphy and Gute need to go... I've been saying it all season. Really Embarrassing... Players are showing signs of frustration and lack of hustle & commitment... Time for changes in the front office.
stockholder
December 17, 2023 at 04:12 pm
The injury reports support your claim.
CanPackFan
December 17, 2023 at 04:47 pm
No. I am tired of all the excuses! Every team has injuries.
We are again betrayed by the great soft, incompetent Barry. Safeties playing too deep exposing the middle of the field making the inside LBs vulnerable. And again, Preston trying to cover WRs short? It looked like a race car moving around a pylon!
I guess even the well heeled fans who don't mind the losing - along with MLF - can accept the excuses for keeping Barry! So for those fans, I say "enjoy the losing"..
. But we deserve better! GPG
White92
December 17, 2023 at 04:16 pm
Wait I read on here not 2 weeks ago that I shouldn't question Gute.
fthisJack
December 18, 2023 at 07:18 am
That's right....Question the guys that are putting a talented playoff team in no man's land week after week. If they had a good DC they probably would be10-6 right now. How many games did they lose on the last drive with Barry's pussy D?
LambeauPlain
December 18, 2023 at 09:35 am
5 games given up at the end of the game with the Packers in the lead...so far this season.
Yesterday was not one of those debacles. Yesterday was iron meeting a D of glass...a shattering of a debacle.
Booner
December 17, 2023 at 04:20 pm
The front office is a joke and the coaching staff and team show it! We are fucked monkeys until the board does its job!!!!
Green Bay Shareholder
December 17, 2023 at 07:52 pm
10000%, been saying it for years, they all should be cutting Arod dividend checks every month. An indoor golf driving range with a Don Hutson statue might work though !
Packer_Fan
December 17, 2023 at 04:15 pm
Ok, last week was the whole team. Today was the defense. Perhaps some defense analysts can answer why?
My thoughts. Barry is just too passive. Not aggressive. Barry should have blitzed to put more pressure on Mayfield. Don't let a QB like that get in rhythm.
So sad, so sad
Doofapotamus
December 17, 2023 at 04:33 pm
It's not the blitz, it's the lack of pressure on the receivers. A few of his sacks came from coverage and it's really hard to get to the QB if you're playing off by 5+ yards and they're just dumping it off underneath. They're also getting great YAC on those plays because there's no one around to tackle them. They have all the area in the world to make plays against GB's defenders because there's no one to contest the throws.
jannesbjornson
December 17, 2023 at 07:11 pm
Just saw Buffalo shut down Cee Dee Lamb with bracket coverage with hi-lo zone. Wyatt was starting to show more inside pressure, yet his reps suffer?
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 10:24 pm
The offense was not exactly winning caliber today. Even clueless MLF said as much. They were just overshadowed by a historically bad defensive performance. I expected better from both after last week.
ricky
December 17, 2023 at 04:16 pm
It sure seems like Barry is amassing a highlights reel of reasons to fire him. As noted in the article, having LBers on the Bucs top receivers was ill conceived. But when it was obvious this wasn't working, it would seem that a change in strategy might be a good idea. NAH! Instead, do the same thing again and again, and hope for different results. This was the strategy of Mike McCarthy at the end of his tenure in GB, but it was expecting the WR's to win their matchups without any kind of help. And when they didn't? Keep doing the same thing. If Barry is brought back next year, I'd have to seriously consider taking a hiatus from watching games until they were rid of the entire coaching staff.
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 05:04 pm
If anyone on this staff returns I want to take a hiatus. I’m too old for this aggravation. I lived with it in the 70s 80s and Mike Sherman eras.
Green Bay Shareholder
December 17, 2023 at 07:57 pm
Mike Sherman was Lombardi like compared to this comedy sketch, plus he was getting 1 paycheck that we are currently paying 2 clowns to do. Look at the revenue gain.
fthisJack
December 18, 2023 at 06:52 am
I think Gute has given this team enough on both sides of the ball to make the playoffs. It's up to the coaching staff to make it happen. They were in prime position to get it done until a 3rd string QB had the best game he'll ever have and then they made a washed up QB torch them for 382 yards. Gute has given them all they need to make the playoffs despite the injuries. Step off the ledge and place the blame where it belongs!
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 08:56 am
I'm not sure our secondary is a strength. If so, coaches lost the players and they weren't even trying, which I was afraid would happen beginning week 4. I don't see clear evidence of this, do you?
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 08:53 am
So we could lose just as many games more efficiently?
I'm having trouble finding the appeal.
Doofapotamus
December 17, 2023 at 04:28 pm
"Awful" is putting it mildly. How many times do we have to see Campbell or another LB line up against their slot receiver? How hard is it to NOT allow that to happen 7+ times a game? They ran zone on so many plays and I think I saw somewhere that Mayfield was 20/24 for 360 and 3 TD's against zone. We have Stokes (man cover, physical corner) Valentine (man cover, physical corner) and Barry is using them like summer tires in the snow. They need to mix it up with man coverage and play more aggressively, because I think I can speak for everyone when I say I am done with the soft zone. Barry's defensive scheme was "bend but don't break" and the Bucs took everything they wanted today and broke GB on MULTIPLE occasions. Something like 9-10 20+ yard plays. That's inexcusable.
#FireJoeBarry
Fubared
December 17, 2023 at 07:06 pm
I have your answer. Stokes and others ar too stupid to play man.. I remember the dig on Stokes was Adams would beat him badly at practice, he made same mistakes over and over. the other backs lack speed, size, mobility and a coach who knows defense.
Doofapotamus
December 18, 2023 at 12:03 am
Valentine is 6'1" and runs a 4.44. He is aggressive and broke up a pass while in excellent position on Mike Evans within 5 yards of the LOS. He is physical and always is around the ball when he's targeted. Eric Stokes had one of the lowest completion percentages in his coverage his rookie year and he was tested by a lot of the best receivers in the game after Alexander got hurt. He was left on an island for the most part and in 2021, the year that Barry first started coaching this defense, the Packers had a near top-10 defense. He was part of that reason. Well, that and Campbell wasn't playing like a bag of chips. You have also seen the damage Adams has done against zone coverage, he struggles when his routes are disrupted. All I know is that playing man can NOT be worse than playing this ridiculous soft zone 9 yards off on 3rd and 4.
CanPackFan
December 17, 2023 at 04:35 pm
FIRE BARRY!
Having LBs covering WRs doesn't surprise me when it comes to Joe Dingle Barry. Heck, he put Preston on Davante Adam's earlier this year with the same result.
Barry is the single greatest liability of this organization. His continued employment is a clear reflection of LaFleurs Head Coaching competence!
No more excuses for Barry. He is easily the worst DC in all of football. He is a flat out disgrace to the legacy of this organization.
FIRE BARRY!
I will not accept the argument that we have to have him for the remainder if this season. He has sabotaged any playoff hopes we had with a talented young team. Find anyone with an aggressive resume and give him a chance. What have we got to lose at this point?
FIRE BARRY!
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:04 am
Suppose they can't bring in a replacement in time. Can you explain why the players wouldn't be better with JB gone? At the end of last season JB asked all his players what they wanted to do and they all said they wanted to be more aggressive. When JB actually did that it worked. We all speculated how long it would take for JB to revert.
Allowing the players to do what they want is sorta like mutiny, without the insubordination. Of course a great DC would be better, but in the absence of that how is this idea worse?
KKB
December 17, 2023 at 04:51 pm
Barry was a terrible hire day 1, and has proven it every year since. I like MLF, but if he doesn't fire Barry NOW, the MLF can go too. And if Gute doesn't insure that happens, then he can go also.
I understand young, inexperienced, and a 500 record. But inept play calling, poor execution, and lack of adjustments are not acceptable.
Play hard, and get beat - sad but understandable. Playing like crap - IS NOT.
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 05:09 pm
He said he wouldn’t fire Barry after the game.
murf7777
December 17, 2023 at 05:37 pm
Is that really what he said? The quote I read was “I’ve got to find solutions. I’ve got to go back and take a look at the film”? Was something else said? Maybe or hopefully the solutions is firing Barry.
CheesedDeadHead
December 17, 2023 at 06:20 pm
" I’ve got to go back and take a look at the film"
There aren't enough hours in the year for MLF to watch film over and over and get it.
Green Bay Shareholder
December 17, 2023 at 08:02 pm
The film from the Giants game was a better watch, same results though. What happened to that soft schedule and running the table No Show Jaire ?
Tundraboy
December 17, 2023 at 06:49 pm
Look at the film? I barely was able to watch any of the game. Checked in towards end of 3rd Qtr when it was still a game, saw a great defensive stop followed up by a 3rd and very long, and next thing I know it's a 1st down at the goal line!
Point is I saw enough in a few minutes to know that it was Barry at his worst. What could possibly be left to see or decide! Just say no comment. Or better yet do everyone a favor and fire him, someone ,anyone.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:12 am
KKB,
you're assuming that MLF has authority to fire JB. I don't think even MLF and Gutey combined have the authority to do that the way this organization is currently structured. And that's the biggest problem. Mike Murphy put that in place, and said if it didn't work it would become evident.
Evidently, it doesn't work. At the end of 2020 we could tell that but there was still maybe some room for doubt. Now? All doubt is gone. The executive board has the authority to remove MM from all football operations, and to remove his silos idea. That would be more gracious to him than firing him right before mandatory retirement, and it seems to me it would help the team just as much. THEN Gutey and MLF combined could fire JB, and maybe one or the other acting alone could too depending on how the new rules for the organization are written. That should all be in place before MM retires in 2025 anyway.
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 04:55 pm
And Valentine had the nerve to celebrate knocking a pass down 45 minutes into the game. Lol.
Season is over, the LeFleur era will only be highlighted by blowing two # 1 seeds. That’s it.
Anyone that thinks it’s only Joe Barry is just going to be pissed off next year when they finish 8-9 or 9-8 without Barry.
Oh, and Christian Watson will miss 6-7 games next year too.
When someone shows you who they are…. Believe them.
Doofapotamus
December 17, 2023 at 05:10 pm
He's celebrating being used the way he should be. We don't have zone corners. Barry is forcing a scheme that is not designed to work with the players we have. There's a reason Douglas is the only guy in our secondary that could reliably pick the opposing QB off.
jannesbjornson
December 17, 2023 at 07:07 pm
If a CB can play man/press, he sure as hell can play an easier zone concept. This guy Barry has the whole crew reading, not attacking. They lose a step and are compromised in the back end which is an average, at best, unit without Jaire. The ILBs are clueless and not inspirational.
Doofapotamus
December 18, 2023 at 12:06 am
You would think that, but there's always guys looking at each other because no one knows who is picking who up as they cross zones. If you have your guy, you know who is covering who and you're not looking wondering why 3 people followed the RB across the middle of the field leaving the TE wide open down the seam. They have no instincts for what's going on behind them and they're reacting to what they see in front of them. If you're playing man, you worry about your man and that's really it
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:35 am
Quay, Campbell and McDuffie are all clueless?!?
Sorry but no. I realize GB just lost 2 games in a row that they should have won and really needed to win, but that's over the top. Even #45 Wilson is better than that, these guys have all made good plays and you can't do that if you're "clueless." If you want to say they don't inspire confidence in YOU that they're going to play well on the very next play, even after they make a good play? Ok, you can say something like that and be reasonable. They've all gotten beat, and on more than a few plays. Pretty sure none are the best in the league at their position, even though that's a subjective comparison.
It will be interesting to see how they address this room in the draft. I'm mostly concerned about the draft part of "draft and develop;" very clearly coaching is not excelling in this aspect. Whether that's at every position or just some I'm not sure, but begin with the O line. I don't see the sense of high draft being used in this defense if JB's still in GB. I'm not familiar with any of the D position coaches but I don't see anything that suggests excellence. LVN not adding technique after College, for example. That seems to directly reflect on an OLB coach who can't teach, or won't.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:21 am
Doof,
thank you! While I understand trading away Rasul Douglas in concept, all Gutey got for him was moving up about 40 draft spots, into the third round, where he's been historically bad. Rasul AND a pick in exchange for one third round pick, and then he called it "a deal too good to pass up." I don't care if it was the going rate at the time, he gave Rasul away for nothing. No way does a third round rookie replace what Rasul did, that's a losing proposition throughout all next season at least. And a crap shoot that it's ever a benefit.
The bigger problem IMHO is it was just a bad way to handle the player. Skill at roster building aside, someone who's so clearly NOT a "people person," can they be a good GM?
Green Bay Shareholder
December 17, 2023 at 08:07 pm
But what about Bahk !
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:43 am
That's a very big question mark. Many here assumed he was gone next year and should be traded this. Once season ending surgery was announced nobody's talked about him much. I think the $20 MM cap hit next season is unavoidable, right?
Many other contracts keep us in cap hell next season, so I can't imagine that the additional $20MM to keep Bakh next season happens. His entire contract gets added to the failed bid of trying to extend AR12's SB window past 2010.
Ouch, but that's the reality. That was a dominant era and it peaked in MLF's first 3 years.
Lphill
December 17, 2023 at 04:57 pm
Barry smiling at the podium answering soft questions is what burns me.
exbody
December 17, 2023 at 04:59 pm
We all know the definition of insanity right ?.
When you have a DC that employs a soft defensive philosophy week after week, year after year and expect an aggressive mindset on the field by the players on defense....
Ain't happening!!! Never has, never will!!!
Last week the Joe Barry coached D lined up a SOFT prevent allowing Tommy DiVito to march right down for a game winning FG. Today, Barry assigned LB Davandre Cambell to cover Chris Godwin. Result... 10 catches 125 yds. Any adjustments to change that ....
NAAAH. Any pressure packages / blitzes to get Baker Mayfield out of his rhythm....NAAAH.
Mayfield looked like Mahomes today , Just like Tommy DiVito looked last week.
PATHETIC... and guess what ?? It ain't gonna change unless MLF finally FIRES this incompetent DC. Soft defensive philosophies produce soft defensive performances!!!!
the die has been cast ..this is what Barry is and this is who he will be. What more evidence does MLF need.
Because if his priority is winning games than firing Joe Barry MUST be done.
Another thought ....does Jaire Alexander no show today a symptom of a bigger problem. My take is that maybe Jaire refuses to play for this terrible DC.
He's been practicing for the last 3 weeks then is listed as out on Sundays. The last SIX Sundays to be exact. Just a thought ...
FIRE BARRY...... NOW!!
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 05:12 pm
Is it also insane to believe MLF will hire a good DC? After all , every major assistant he has hired has been a disaster.
I think it’s more insane to think MLF will ever be a winner here. No matter who the assistants are.
Fubared
December 17, 2023 at 08:04 pm
Okay your at the four and it's 3rd down. One yard for first down. Options, roll out qb for the first. Pass short to someone in end zone for TD or you run your running back straight ahead into the los. Keep in mind, we tried twice already to get the first and this team needs to win or season over, this ain't the first game of the season.
We run straight ahead for a loss of one yard. This is your hc making this decision. So do you really think he is capable of dealing with the defense when he has the offensive scheme all fucked up.
Screen play to the out when you need 11 yards for a first? Qb making quick decisions no one open I will dump this off for a one yard gain even though I need 8 yards for a first.
This is a team that isn't practicing anything beyond basic.
You bring in drake who doesn't know the plays when you have Taylor who knows the system and played well the previous week. who is running this dis organized clown show.
I'm convinced the hc is a know nothing who Rodgers carried. Barry is his twin know nothing.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:48 am
Exbody, you're assuming MLF has the authority to fire JB. That requires Mike Murphy's approval. Would MM do it if Gutey and MLF both made a strong case?
I feared player mutiny beginning week 4.
KKB
December 18, 2023 at 01:52 pm
i was wondering the same thing about Jaire. First coach Gray, Thaen Rasul, and now Jaire.
CANCER is spreading - it's time to remove the tumor.
RosserPackfan
December 17, 2023 at 05:01 pm
I've seen enough passive, let's play 10 yards off the receiver regardless of the sticks to last a lifetime. Enough is enough Matt! Grow a pair, admit you made the wrong choice and move on from this joker.
vin0770
December 17, 2023 at 05:08 pm
Clearly the players don’t buy into the bull$hit Barry is selling but MLF is. Jaire has already told us what he thinks of Barry but his buddy MLF keeps him employed.
So what do the players then think about there no one’s accountable pussy HC? Three games left and the players will show you what they think of their leadership.
baldski
December 17, 2023 at 08:44 pm
I agree. The defense knows "Barry Ball" does not work so why should they bust their ass to prove it does not work? Barry has lost them.
NDP
December 17, 2023 at 05:24 pm
Matt Lafleur said twice that "we were outcoached" during his press conference. What do those words say about Matt Lafleur? Does he understand that those words implicate him in these past two losses as much as they do Joe Barry? Why does Matt Lafleur continue to keep Joe Barry as his defensive coordinator? Joe Barry doesn't want to make changes during games, and Matt Lafleur doesn't want to change his defensive coordinator. This was an embarrassing loss today. As difficult as it is for me to write this, I often think that Matt Lafleur and Joe Barry must go. Go Pack Go.
CheesedDeadHead
December 17, 2023 at 06:23 pm
"Matt Lafleur said twice that "we were outcoached" during his press conference. "
And yet the idea we need better coaches will never cross his mind.
CheeseEdWest2
December 17, 2023 at 10:24 pm
The way MLF used AJ made me think MLF either needs to hire a true OC or fire himself. Where was the play action? Where was the motion? When you have a true running threat--and then you call seven runs in a row and fool noone...with no play action, and then run empty backfield play after play, that's not the illusion of complexity, it's the illusion of an offensive game plan.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:55 am
MLFs weaknesses are all within HC duties, and all his strengths fall within an OC job description. I don't think it's a stretch to conclude that MLF is not a HC but might do ok as an OC.
Clock management, in-game adjustment, and player evaluation and selection have never been MLF's strengths. Even great players cannot overcome mistakes at that level. They deserve a good HC. I also don't see that Stenavitch brought anything to the OC position, but he was at least good as O line position group coach.
Aldo
December 17, 2023 at 05:28 pm
I was fearful when LeFleur decided to keep Barry after last year, but now, it's insanity that this guy is still the Packer's defensive coordinator. I have better things to do rather than watch the Pack give up the yardage they seem determined to give to the opposition. It's called the "Keystone Cops Defense", but it's not hilarious, just the opposite. Bad decsions have lead to bad outcomes.
lou
December 17, 2023 at 05:28 pm
The Press Corp needs not ask why haven't you fired Joe Barry but based on his resume why DID YOU HIRE JOE BARRY. Even his father in law Rod Marinelli as head coach with the Lion's couldn't retain him;
The main reason those Lions went 0-16 in 2008 is because they featured one of the worst defenses in the history of the league led by Joe Barry. Detroit allowed 517 points in 2008, the second-most of all time behind only the 1981 Baltimore Colts. The Lions gave up 30 points in 11 of 16 games, and ranked last in the league in both passing defense (allowing 8.8 yards per pass attempt while recording just four interceptions) and rushing defense (allowing 5.1 yards per carry and 31 touchdowns).
His tenure with Washington was almost as bad;
Barry spent the past two seasons as the Redskins' defensive coordinator, and they ranked 28th in the NFL in each of them. Washington allowed 377.9 yards a game this past season en route to going 8-7-1 and missing the playoffs.
The Redskins had the worst third-down defense in the league and were 24th against the run and 25th against the pass.
And today he sets a FIRST, allowing the first opposing QB to have a perfect QB rating at City Stadium/Lambeau Field circa 1959.
aberk
December 17, 2023 at 09:42 pm
Fire MLF for hiring J the Know Nothing J Barry Defensive Coach and then fire Barry.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 09:58 am
It all starts at the top with Mike Murphy.
Cubbygold
December 17, 2023 at 05:38 pm
Terrible defense, AND...
The offense only scores 13 points if the defense doesn't get the early strip sack. Obviously no Watson, Musgrave and had injured wicks and reed... so I get it... but still not great
murf7777
December 17, 2023 at 05:41 pm
I don’t really see the offense being the problem. I’ve seen a lot of growth throughout the year with this very young team, especially when you consider all the injuries they’ve played thru.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:03 am
O line hasn't allowed the O to do what it should. That starts with Butkus and he should be the first one out the door. Consider him a Chicago plant, sent here to destroy the team. It's possible that the Bears wind up with a better record this season.
Stenavitch has brought what as OC? Combined with Butkus and MLF, they're not good. MLF as OC with Stenavitch back as O line position group coach would be at least an improvement. Need a real HC! Promoting RB to assistant HC seemed to help nothing, just a move to prevent him from being sniped away by another team.
Certainly the reps to the yutes on O has helped! Playing time is valuable, regardless what coaches should be doing (but aren't) to develop them.
saltandpeppers
December 17, 2023 at 05:45 pm
I mean, you have to lose 8 to go 9-8.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:06 am
Lose 8? No problem! They have three more chances to get one loss, JB can exceed that goal.
relleum61
December 17, 2023 at 06:13 pm
There is a reason that I have nicknamed to GB defense "The Manage-ables" all year long. No down, distance or time frame is unmanageable for the opposition offense against a JB defense. How many _____ & longs were there today? How many did Baker Mayfield convert. The BM QB rating of 158.3 suggests that he converted almost all.
The contrast was the TB defense. Jordan Love had the Packers moving on offense in their last two drives. Both drives were stopped when the TB defense executed perfectly executed blitzes in both situations. Net result: 3 total points and no hope of a wild comeback. This is just one reason that the first seasons of Love and AR as starting QB's are eerily similar...both were hamstrung by passive defenses. Will MLF fire JB like McCarthy fired Bob Sanders? Does MLF have a choice at this point? We shall see.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:08 am
MLF has no authority within this organizational structure to fire JB. That has to go through Mike Murphy.
cheesehead1
December 17, 2023 at 06:16 pm
Another embarrassing performance overall. Love still misses way too many easy completions but does make some excellent throws at times. I wouldn’t rush signing him to any lucrative long term deal just yet. Let’s see what he’s done after next season. As far as the D is concerned, what else is there to say. Just read the Baker had the first perfect passer rating at Lambeau for an opposing QB. I’m pretty sure most GB fans would agree that Barry should have been let go after last season. MLF’s press conferences are starting to sound old, nothing changes. Anyway, on to next week.
dobber
December 17, 2023 at 06:55 pm
Only the Packers could surrender 450 yards of total offense and see their rush defense statistically improve.
jannesbjornson
December 17, 2023 at 07:24 pm
Tray of Danish Kringle.
dobber
December 18, 2023 at 07:38 am
I could really go for a good Racine Kringle....
Lphill
December 17, 2023 at 07:07 pm
Grow some balls MLF and fire Barry now .
ArodsLeftNut
December 17, 2023 at 07:07 pm
HEADLINE: Packers coach Matt LaFleur seeks 'solutions' after defense 'shredded' in loss.
Answer: fire Barry and let Gute hire next DC (you've not shown abiliry to do what's in the best interest of the team). Also, throughput the season you frequently mentioned (correctly by the way) that you were out-coached. Just curious, you don't see that as part of the problem?
dobber
December 18, 2023 at 07:40 am
If they fire Barry, they won't be hiring a new DC from the outside now. They'll elevate an assistant as interim and hire after the season's done.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:10 am
I fail to see how that could possibly be worse.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:15 am
It all starts with Mike Murphy. At the very least the executive board can remove him from all football operations, and remove his silos idea. This would allow him to retire in 2025 as planned, and help the team just as much as kicking him out the door today.
Agreed that MLF does not make good decisions re: personnel; either coaches or players. He's an OC. GB needs a HC. Move Stenavitch back down to O line position group coach and (along with these other changes) maybe you right this ship.
LeotisHarris
December 17, 2023 at 07:18 pm
How embarrassing is this little nugget? Baker effing Mayfield is first opposing QB ever to have a perfect passer rating at Lambeau.
dobber
December 18, 2023 at 07:40 am
For those who are wondering, "Effing" is his actual middle name.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:17 am
Baker Effing Mayfield, named after Effing, SC.
Since'75
December 17, 2023 at 07:18 pm
We, as Packer fans, or the Packer team themselves, can't be concerned with what pick the Chicago Bears have.
I'm reading that and i'm saying...really?...out loud.
Who gives a f what pick the Bears have, you have enough issues on your team right?
Take care of your own business.
Getting preoccupied with what pick another team has is insane.
Insanity is worrying about something you have no control over.
I don't get as bent out of shape about this team that many do, only because about 7,8 years ago i adjusted my emotion and my outlook on this team.
Frankly, since the Seattle NFCCG, i've been waiting patiently for this upper management to be turned over.
I never really liked Murphy, and i don't have a very high opinion about Gute.
I liked Thompson, but i knew something was wrong with him by that time.
I also knew the team was regressing and that Murphy should have replaced him at that time.
It is what it is, downvote me if you like, and then go have a cookie, i give no f.
I've complained over a good amount of years how many resources went to the defense.
I could explain it by going over all the high draft choices since 2012, plus all the free agent signings in 2019 that went mostly to the defense.
But i'll trust that informed Packer fans already know that.
My complaint is twofold, and i'll keep it simple as i don't want this turning into a novel......
1) If they are going to spend over a decade of prime draft choices on defense....then damn it, shouldn't we be seeing some f'ing results?!?!
2) By doing so, the offense got ignored, mostly pass catching. If half of those draft picks went to the offense, i can't help but think we very well may have won another SB.
We were one game away from the SB two years in a row.
So what did we do?
We finally drafted an offensive player in the first round in a receiver rich draft!!
The Packers traded up for and drafted a QB to sit on the bench for years, while we were knocking on the SB door.
I said in 2020.....This team should have traded Rodgers to the 49ers when they inquired about Rodgers, when Rodgers asked to be traded, the Packers would have gotten a Kings ransom.
They could have done it in 2020, or 21
Plus, that would have avoided all the drama through those last 3 years.
I'm sorry, i've been a Packer fan all my life and i will die a Packer fan.
But i vote no confidence in Packer upper management.
So i bide my time until they get purged out. I still watch EVERY game, still follow the team (obviously)
But i refused to get pissed off anymore over this management structure, so in the meantime, i find my entertainment in this team, where i can find it.
White92
December 17, 2023 at 07:42 pm
I watched Tee Higgins play like a beast yesterday and could only think what might have been if the Packers had drafted him instead of trading up for Love...
Since'75
December 17, 2023 at 08:05 pm
Yep, the Packers could have traded up for a handful of premier receivers.
barutanseijin
December 17, 2023 at 09:12 pm
In hindsight what they needed was more beef on the OL. They were outmatched in the trenches without Bakhtiari. Their hands were tied because they had limited their options on offense by drafting so many defensive duds.
That’s why i agree about the Packers’ strategic errors. The Aaron Rodgers and a bunch of guys philosophy didn’t work. That being the case, it would have been wise to unload him earlier than they did. By the time they figured it out, Schneider had already poisoned the well by ripping off Denver.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:23 am
Yes, that's what needed to be done in order to make the "all in" idea make any sense.
Not saying JL10 can't be the franchise QB of the future or at least a few years, but that was having each foot in a different boat. The team has officially wound up in the drink!
Agreed that the solution is much more about FO and coaching staff than it is players at this point, not that this is a complete roster.
Green Bay Shareholder
December 17, 2023 at 10:12 pm
You Sir sum up my thoughts exactly, for the same reasons about the same people starting at the same time - NFC Championship Game against Seattle. Like I have stated many times - all the coaches and executives in this organization should have been cutting monthly dividend checks to Aaron Rodgers since that game, because without his other worldly QB play this organization would have made the Bears seem like a Dynasty. It was on his shoulders for a decade as they continued to spend draft capital and keep missing on defense, over and over and over while losing players from the team they inherited every year till the cupboard was empty, other than where it is now, rookies, 2nd year players and broken down veterans. So many missed opportunities to add the talent that would get us another Trophy like when they went out and got Woodson. Glad someone else sees it.
Since'75
December 19, 2023 at 07:28 pm
PREACH!!
Thank you GBS
Johnkrash
December 17, 2023 at 07:24 pm
Another week, another Barry defense that looks completely unprepared for an opponent. In game adjustments? Nah. Any hope that this gets better? Nah. MLF ultimately is to blame for allowing this to go on while making excuses week after week.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:25 am
MLF doesn't have the authority in this organizational structure to fire MLF. The bright spot here is that when asked about firing JB he didn't answer no, he said they have to go watch the film.
Fubared
December 17, 2023 at 08:23 pm
Sadly after pre season I assessed this as a 6 win, seven tops team. I actually had them last in the nfc north but the bears earned that distinction.
I really hate to be right on this one but the Lions, Vikes and Bears got decent draft picks and free agents to boost their team.
My concern, this team needs a total defense rebuild and that will take years and a new coach. Expect a lot of pain the next few years hey the Lions are very young and so is the Vikes d.
barutanseijin
December 17, 2023 at 09:17 pm
Oh look, it’s the Vikings troll. Enjoy your L this week?
dobber
December 18, 2023 at 07:44 am
"Sadly after pre season I assessed this as a 6 win, seven tops team."
You also spouted just last week that the Vikings would run the table. Not looking so prescient at this stage.
I know prescient is a big word for you, but you can go look that one up....use "G-o-o-g-l-e".
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:27 am
Da Bares haven't earned last place in the NFC north, GB could still earn that.
It'd be nice if just ONE of your comments at least wasn't factually inaccurate.
joejetson
December 17, 2023 at 08:34 pm
I'm really tired of Pepe LeFleur saying "We were out coached" after every loss. OK, if you were "out coached" every week, what, as the team leader, did you do about it?
Obviously, not a damn thing.
Even my wife says "Why are they always five yards off the receivers?"
I reply, "That's Joe Barry's zone defense".
She says, "Then why don't they try something else?"
I just shake my head and say, "That's what Pepe wants, apparently."
The point is that you can blame Joe Barry all you want, but Pepe LeFleur has the final say. He's the Head Coach, not Barry.
I'd like to see them both gone, let Bisaccia close out the season, and then clean out the entire coaching staff after the season is mercifully over.
My main concern is that this team is so poorly coached we don't even know if the players we have are any good or not.
You can't blame the players if the scheme itself is flawed.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:32 am
Before week 1 I was thinking RB's promotion to assistant HC might result in what you're suggesting if needed. Now? I see nothing to suggest that would be a solution.
Neither do I think "fire them all" is a great team building exercise. There's a long list of coaches that obviously need to be replaced. Stenavitch was at least good as O line position group coach. MLF might be good as OC, but HC duties are proven to be his weakness.
Rebelgb
December 18, 2023 at 11:19 am
"My main concern is that this team is so poorly coached we don't even know if the players we have are any good or not.
You can't blame the players if the scheme itself is flawed."
This is exactly my concern as well.
stockholder
December 17, 2023 at 09:18 pm
I think this explains everything- Baker Mayfield had a perfect passer rating, the first ever for a visiting quarterback at Lambeau Field, on the way to a 34-20 Buccaneers win. According to Pro Football Focus’ charting, the Packers’ coverage grades were the worst among any team in any game over the last five years,
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:33 am
Yup, that sounds like what I watched.
But hey, at least Gutey gave away Rasul Douglas and got nothing in return so that's a positive, right?
harleycops
December 17, 2023 at 10:16 pm
The Packers have choked the last 2 games. It is time for them to choke the next 3 and move up the draft board. This team is in shambles and LaFleuzy is the blame with a staff that can't score points, stop points, and not give up. It's obvious the team has thrown in the towel. Players are no longer on board with their coaching. When is LaFleuzy going to have the balls to can Barry and the entire defensive staff. Heck, he ain't so good on offense either. The Chargers are in the tank and fired their coach. The Packers are in the tank and should they fire their coach? Is LaFleuzy's seat on warm and another loss - it goes on hot? We all know the team is young, but this is the NFL and every team is out to spank the little boys. This is disgusting, an embarrassment to Wisconsin and PackerNation. Face it, gang; we're not going to the playoffs. We don't belong there, and even we got there - we'd get killed by SF or anyone else. Looking forward to 2024 season!
Fubared
December 17, 2023 at 10:22 pm
Your assuming like a lot of others that Gutt wants an early first round pick.
They have no money in the piggy bank so he will trade way back into the first and take a 5th rounder to boot.
This team management is more about managing the money they putting a great team together.
They arent trying to get free agents, trades and upgrades because they dont have the money. Rodgers has there money
fthisJack
December 18, 2023 at 07:10 am
They have enough talent to make the playoffs. It's the coaching that is the weak link.
Bitternotsour
December 18, 2023 at 10:23 am
I guess the Viking boards aren't much fun anymore, you've been really active over here. Do you figure you'll be forced to sign Kirk for another few years, or are you consigned yet again to years in the wilderness with bad quarterbacks and ugly uniforms?
SinceLombardi
December 17, 2023 at 10:17 pm
How could you watch the Giants game and not expect this to go this way? It’s pretty obvious that two good games have overshadowed the other 12. How many years does MLF get?
When exactly does it become his fault? Does he really get to pick the next DC??
His track record with assistant coaches is incredibly bad. His must win game record is terrible. His teams are soft, predictable and mistake prone. Yet it’s always someone else’s fault. Barry sucks, but they have a few ugly losses this year on the offense too. I’m fact it’s about 50/50.
It’s so tiring… I can’t see the results being any different in 2024 no matter who the DC is.
I think the number is 8. That’s 8 wins in 2024, and 8 games for Christian Watson.
Rebelgb
December 18, 2023 at 11:22 am
Christian Watson 8 games? Highly unlikely. If we get 6 we are lucky.
albert999
December 17, 2023 at 10:50 pm
Matt la flower asked about the defense in post game conference says it happens all the time
Fucking seriously?
No change no change
It’s like an alcoholic
albert999
December 17, 2023 at 10:53 pm
Fucking joke…hes not a head coach
gsd3
December 18, 2023 at 03:03 am
Joe Barry has everything so messed up its actually hard to tell the talent level of the players on the field. Linebackers are not capable of covering slot receivers. There could be a unit made up of all pro's out there and Barry would find a way to misuse them. He has to go now. Let Olividatti take over for the rest of the season.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:39 am
Does Olividatti deserve it? If the pass rushers are better than ILBs, wouldn't Rebrovich be the better interim promotion?
Turophile
December 18, 2023 at 05:31 am
Ok. It's over-reaction Monday and the fire everybody crowd is out in force.
Joe Barry, yes, he has shown too many times that he cannot do his job - and worse, when he gets things wrong he seems unable to adjust his game plan effectively.
Beyond that, I'd like to see a little churn of position coaches (I've been touting this thought for a while), just like you would churn the roster each year, in an attempt to get better. Even one position coach change a year would be something. When no-one else seems to be poaching your own coaches regularly for a promotion elsewhere, you are not doing it right.
Murphy stays (until his presidency ends), Gute stays, LaFleur stays.
SicSemperTyrannis
December 18, 2023 at 10:42 am
It all starts with Murphy. The executive board could remove him from football operations entirely, and remove his silos idea to create a reasonable organization. Until that happens the team will underachieve.
They could do that and Murphy stays until his planned retirement in 2025.