Confessions of a Polluted Mindset - Ready or Not?

The Weekly Packers Brain Drain from Jersey Al.

Finally Ready to Play - It's pretty amazing to hear Aaron Rodgers tell Pat McAfee that Sunday night was the first time this season the Packers felt ready to play from an "energy" standpoint. Really? Eight games into the season? A few thoughts on this. Kudos to all of us that watched the Packers games and bemoaned their seeming lack of effort. Evidently, it's obvious even from the comfort of our couches. In this year of manifestation, did the poor efforts manifest the bad performances? (rhetorical question, no need to answer)  What an indictment of the coaching staff and the leadership on this team! I see it in LaFleur when he gets up at press conferences and bemoans the same things that "weren't good enough" week after week. 

Offensive Lessons - Out of sheer necessity, the Packers learned what they didn't seem to actually believe - that they can successfully run the ball - even against a top defense like Buffalo. And when you do that, play action and those deep shots you cherish so dearly tend to work more often.

Blah, blah, blah - This Packers defense talks a much better game than they play, Talking tough does not make you tough, it just makes you look really stupid when you continue to play soft.

DBak - How good is a not-so-healthy David Bakhtiari? Von Miller, who has been loudly wrecking games for the Bills' defense, was silent against DBak. Not a peep. No sacks, no QB hits, no hurries. nothing, nada, zilch.

Claypool - So the Packers were in on the "Chase," offering a second-round draft pick. Personally, I'm glad the Steelers took the Bears' second-round pick instead. Overpaying for a WR the Steelers are giving up on that isn't likely to move the needle that much for the Packers would have been ill-advised. 

PFF - I honestly don't know what  ProFootballFocus is looking at sometimes. For example, they credited Savage with a single missed tackle - I have him at five. Then they give Preston Smith a terrible grade when he was the only guy consistently making plays.

Bounceback - It was great to see Doubs bounce back after what was a really tough outing the week before against the Commanders. It would be easy for a rookie to get down on himself and lose confidence, but Romeo showed none of that. 

Toure, Toure, Toure - About time this kid was given an opportunity, even if it took injuries to do so. 

Watkins - It's puzzling how quiet Watkins was in this game (1 catch for 3 yards). Were the Bills giving him the WR1 treatment with Lazard and Cobb out? Or is he just not that good?

Walker - I've watched the video dozens of times - it's hard to see anything Walker should have gotten upset about enough to do what he did. Dumb as hell, but I'm not going to kill the kid. I'm just going to chalk it up to a youthful mistake (we've all made them) and one that is unlikely to be repeated.

__________________________

"Jersey Al" Bracco is the Editor-In-Chief, part owner and wearer of many hats for CheeseheadTV.com and PackersTalk.com. He is also a recovering Mason Crosby truther.  Follow Al on twitter at @JerseyalGBP

12 points

Comments (98)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
Savage57's picture

November 02, 2022 at 06:13 am

It looked like AR was finally getting over his ayahuasca hangover in the second half.

The job the TE's did blocking in the run game was notable.

Nothing's going to change with this defense until someone convinces them to prosecute the action, not wait for it.

Savage is an embarrassment to the clan.

Walker's pissy fit reminded me of an episode of Chappelle's "When Keeping It Real Goes Wrong."

12 points
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Since'61's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:37 am

Brilliant post Savage57, as usual. Thanks, Since '61

2 points
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packerbackerjim's picture

November 02, 2022 at 06:23 am

That was Walker’s second dumb penalty. Immature.
Anytime I see PFF I stop reading.
The run/pass balance is apparently elusive as hell. Coaches talk about wanting it, but never calling it.
I keep wanting MLF to graduate to an upper level HC, but into his 4th season, it isn’t going to happen.

14 points
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bjkdad44's picture

November 02, 2022 at 12:34 pm

Spot on!!!

0 points
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Spock's picture

November 02, 2022 at 06:25 am

Al, you're spot on with this column as always. Eight games to get your team to show some effort? Not to mention MLF goes on record during halftime as needing to challenge the team to play. Shameful. I said to my wife during the 2nd half what many here have also said, "If the team played like this the previous games they'd have won most of them."

10 points
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Coldworld's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:07 am

It’s actually worse, I agree: the effort didn’t come till the second half: LaFleur stated after half time that he’d had to exhort his players to play hard.

This coaching regime is bankrupt. LaFleur is a massive failure as a leader and the symptoms are everywhere.

5 points
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Packerpasty's picture

November 02, 2022 at 04:56 pm

he (MLF) should be an offensive co-ord or a Div II college coach...when he was at Titans Derrick Henry didn't have the years he is having since he left...he has no idea how get a team fired up and our D coach is for sure not aggressive enough with the players he has...theyre all chickens*t to be aggressive..

2 points
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NickPerry's picture

November 02, 2022 at 06:35 am

"Ready to Play - It's pretty amazing to hear Aaron Rodgers tell Pat McAfee that Sunday night was the first time this season the Packers felt ready to play from an "energy" standpoint. "

Haven't listened to this week's McAfee yet but I'm sure I will at some point. WOW, this dude just can't shut the hell up. Last week he's telling blabbing on and on about taking reps from his teammates when his own play hasn't been very good. Now, he's basically saying EVERY coach has failed to do a big part of their job...Get their team ready to play. Wow, that contract just keeps getting worse and worse every day.

Blah, blah, blah

I've never been a fan of the entire defense going to the opposing endzone as a group celebrating a TO. It makes me absolutely crazy and frankly embarrassed when your LOSING a game by double digits and the opposing offense has moved the ball pretty much whenever they felt like it, and the Packer's defense celebrates a TO. Really? UGH!

I'm torn on the Claypool trade. Part of me wanted Claypool but ONLY Claypool. BUT, I think a Packers 2nd would have too much too. The Packers and Bears are both 3-5 and I'm not so sure the Packers finish ahead of the Bears in the standings. Other than MAYBE beating the Bears, where exactly (be honest) do you see the Packers winning another game? I don't think they'll win AT Detroit. Dallas, Tennessee, and Philly are going to absolutely smoke GB which sets us up for the "Draft Spot Bowl" with the Bears in week 14.

IMO Pittsburgh just cost themselves a higher 2nd round draft pick by not trading with GB.

7 points
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Guam's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:58 am

I'm not torn on the Claypool miss (he was in Tomlin's doghouse for reasons), but I am steamed about missing Hockenson. Tonyan is not all the way back and Lewis is an offensive lineman at this point - the Packers certainly could have used a good, young pass catching TE. Second in 2022 and third in 2023 with two fourths coming back with Hockenson so the price was reasonable. This could have been a key player for the Packers for years to come.

10 points
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PeteK's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:06 am

Guam, Hockenson is a force and so was a steal for Ikes. He is going to flourish in that offense. I'm turning green.

5 points
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Razer's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:56 am

If it is any consolation, Hockenson is a tight end. We wouldn't know what to do with him :o)

3 points
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dobber's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:01 am

It's the truth in this statement that has me crying while I laugh.

5 points
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dobber's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:08 am

First off...Claypool has apparently been a dog since getting some featured looks in his rookie year. By most accounts, he's not dedicated to his craft. That being the case, his low contract and chance to turn around probably inflated his value, so I actually think Pittsburgh made out on that one. I'm not one to look at a guy's HW numbers and say, "make him a TE", but I bet he ends up a TE.

Speaking of TEs, you need to look at that Hockenson deal to realize that the Lions really pretty much sold him at a discount. They sent him with their own 4th and 5th...the 4th is going to be a high 4th. And they got a 2nd and a 3rd in return...both are likely to be later-round picks. Former first-round pick, productive in spurts (when he's healthy--he's on the injury reports a lot), but has long periods where he disappears. He's one of those "building block" pieces that developing teams want to retain...so ask yourself why they didn't? He was going to need to be paid...maybe that's the issue.

3 points
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Coldworld's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:12 am

He’s cheap this year but not next and thereafter. He’s not an option for us other than as a rental as a result of how we’ve hamstrung our cap. Renting him at this point makes no sense for us. The Vikings cap improves before ours and they are seeing themselves as contenders. I see their rationale, but we took ourselves out of that by both play and cap committed in future to get us where we are.

-1 points
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HawkPacker's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:40 am

He was drafted in 2019 so next season would be his fifth year option. We blew it not trading for him. We could have dumped someone else to save the money to be able to pay him. Lowry possibly?

2 points
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Coldworld's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:58 am

His salary next year is 9 million plus. We are over the cap to start the year (Lowry will be out of contract so is not counted) as we stand now and we can’t release significant cap from players like Bakh because we’ve structured dead money so heavily. Signing him would perhaps finally kill any possibility of a Jones or Amos extension and possibly force us to deal a high value player even without that.

We have dug a huge hole for ourselves with the cap for at least a couple of years. These are the prices we pay for having done so.

1 points
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Since'61's picture

November 02, 2022 at 10:21 am

Nick- I'm not a fan of the defensive celebrations either especially when the Packers are losing and playing on the road.

They should consider Paul Brown's advice, "When you win say nothing, when you lose say less."

Good post. Thanks, Since '61

8 points
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HawkPacker's picture

November 02, 2022 at 01:05 pm

I agree Since'61. When any team does their 'celebration', I do say to myself 'and these are adults?'.

There was one celebration that I remember from years ago that I absolutely broke out with a laugh. That was db Merton Hanks of the 49ers, years ago, doing his dance. He looked like he was going to snap his neck. It hurt just to think about it but very funny indeed.

-1 points
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Rebecca's picture

November 02, 2022 at 05:56 pm

I don’t know who said it but maybe Saint Vincent: “If you score a touchdown act like you’ve been there before.”

2 points
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NickPerry's picture

November 03, 2022 at 06:05 am

Hi Since "61...Yours was even better. I love that advice by Paul Brown.

Remember when Barry Sanders would score? His was the best celebration ever (OTHER than the Lambeau Leap). He would score and just hand the ball to the Ref as if he was saying, "Here ya go, I'll be right back with another". And he usually was.

1 points
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Packerpasty's picture

November 03, 2022 at 06:48 pm

of course your not, your old now just like me, but I refuse to be a curmudgeon...

0 points
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bjkdad44's picture

November 02, 2022 at 12:37 pm

I was thinking the same thing about when the celebrate in the end zone… what a GD shame!!!! :p

0 points
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T7Steve's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:08 am

Aaron Rodgers saying "this was the first game we were ready to play" is actually throwing himself under the bus for the first time. Being a leader on the team that's part of his job too. And, if true, why hasn't he mentioned this before (actually after the first game)?

Everyone is down on Savage and even Stokes to a degree. This too is an indication of how bad these young players have been coached and used. They have speed and athleticism, the only things you can't teach. If you got rid of them, another team would pounce on them and turn them into the players they can become. We've seen this with other DBs that have gone to other teams (like Buffalo).

I agree we didn't need to get Chase. I thought the Bears showed the Packers how a front office should build a team. Trade away your best players on defense, and give your quarterback a new toy, but still don't address the O-line. Sound familiar? Maybe the Bears are learning from the Packers. I always try to find the bright side.

0 points
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Coldworld's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:15 am

It suggests that the O is just as full of discontent as the D is allegedly. This team is teetering.

0 points
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stockholder's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:35 am

Finally ready to play- Maybe the offense was. But the Defense sure wasn't.
DBak. - Sorry, but I still view him as a part-timer. Jenkins Too. Hell, the whole OL is a bunch of Part-Timers. But I guess since they're socially acceptable. Rodger's is still public enemy #1 for criticism.
Claypool. - If the packers wanted him that bad. Gutey must know he made a draft mistake.
Toure Toure Toure - has been my Battle Cry. The depth chart shows him outside now. Yet, the slot has always been the problem.
Walker- At least the kid is doing something. Even if he was wrong. I still think he might be a better OLB than ILB. Think CM3???

1 points
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PearlyBakerBest's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:52 am

Gotta agree with you on Walker. Immature reaction? Sure. But it was the first sign of fire from anyone on this team. I live in Cleveland and last week after their game reports were there was yelling and screaming in the locker room afterwards. Then came out and imposed themselves in the Bengals. Wishing for that to happen with this team.

7 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

November 02, 2022 at 01:59 pm

They need to go with four down linemen (hand in the ground) via 4-3/4-2 looks. Krys Barnes should help when he comes back and Wilson was a good pickup for SpT. We all knew the score from Game One; the veteran WRs were slow, brittle and best used as #3-5 type guys. Gutedkunst's failure to bag a TE from this year's class was a crime, then he can't sweeten the pot for Hockenson?? No guts, no glory. I liked Devin Lloyd over Walker and still maintain the position. We will see. I agreed, he should be coming off the Edge and stunting with the DE-5/OLB. He is not physical enough to shoot the A gaps , or is poorly coached in the technique. Do not expect Teddy Bruschi.
Finally, this cluster of an Offense seems to understand the need for a Fullback with Deguara in the spot, full squadron of TEs and downhill running for Dillon. The RPO bullshit can stay in college. It is designed for a running QB who may or may not make it through a NFL season in one piece. The WR position has to run through the rookies who should be capable to play with the big boys @ this point in time. Denny Green, "No time for Crybabies."

4 points
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stockholder's picture

November 02, 2022 at 02:15 pm

Loyd is doing great- And I feel that the 4-3 should be used again. I still believe the packers should take a DT again this draft. Because we don't have anything close to the DLs that won the Super Bowls. We're 27th in the NFL! And it's because Gutey refused to fix it. Hopefully that changes.

3 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

November 02, 2022 at 06:13 pm

He brought in some big bodies like Slaton and Ford to plug the NT, ostensibly to free up Kenny Clark as a 3-6 tech.
I have not watched the D line closely enough, but it looks like their stunts are blown up before they make a step.
They should have six in rotation on game days. Keep them fresh.

2 points
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dgtalmn's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:47 am

It is pretty obvious that the NFL Preseason is actually the first couple of real games. Just so sloppy.

2 points
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Coldworld's picture

November 02, 2022 at 10:00 am

7 apparently, a little over 40%.

2 points
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Packers0808's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:49 am

Have seen no reason yet unless I missed it for Walkers penalty. Makes me wonder if something racial set that off?

-3 points
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Rarescope's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:53 am

He said he thought he was pushed from behind. Which makes it weird for him to not turn around before lashing out. Sounds like a simple heat of the moment misconception case.

3 points
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Packers0808's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:47 am

Ok thanks, glad nothing racial involved.

2 points
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PeteK's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:00 am

--Dropped TDs and first downs, veteran O linemen not playing up to their standards, defensive players missing tkls; the coaches bear some responsibility, but I put more onus on the players.
-- I would have loved Ridley for a 4th and possible 3rd in 2024. Call the police, the Falcons got robbed!

-4 points
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bjkdad44's picture

November 02, 2022 at 12:43 pm

I think the coaches need to do their jobs and actually teach!… as the best coach ever said… be teachers of the game… in all aspects… and nonsense to being their friend…

2 points
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Razer's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:02 am

The Buffalo game was bittersweet. On one hand, I did see the flicker of life that the offense could use to start a real fire. The O-line is still wonky but the run game is a good foundation to build a pass game on. This needs to be encouraged. I think Rodgers accepts this. Fingers crossed.

The bitter part is realizing that your team is not going to contend for the top prize. There are just too many holes in this squad and it's coaching. D-line just isn't good enough, safeties are not good and the defense doesn't play with any toughness.

I do like the suggestion of trying Savage in the slot and giving Rasul a shot at safety. In four years Savage has shown the ability to run fast but I have yet to see a football instinct emerge. Douglas drips with football sense.

7 points
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Guam's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:54 am

Spot on comments Razer!

2 points
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TXCHEESE's picture

November 02, 2022 at 10:58 am

How about trying Savage on the bench. Any decent receiver would wear him out one on one.

6 points
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Bitternotsour's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:14 am

When does this nightmare season and the cap hell it has created land at Mark Murphy's feet. he bent the board and accrued all the power. this is the end result. Now is the time the Thompson model of a GM who runs football operations needs to be reset when Murphy hits the bricks (like, how about now). Mark Murphy should have stuck to opening toboggann hills and kept his hands off football.

7 points
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RCPackerFan's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:16 am

Finally Ready to Play -
What has changed from previous years to this year? Coaching, they lost a quite a few coaches in the offseason. That seems to have played a big part in this. They have 13 rookies on the roster right now. That makes a big difference. Maybe they are going to finally get something going.

Offensive Lessons -
They finally found an identity. And that was run the offense through the running game. Take what the defense gives you. Jones and Dillon were running with a purpose. Also it seemed that Dillon played harder after he got hurt. Maybe that will ignite him more.

Blah, blah, blah -
Playing soft can happen from coaching. Playing soft coverages a lot can have that effect.

DBak -
Lets be honest. He is the best LT in the league. I am wiling to bet that if Bakhtiari plays either of the last 2 playoffs the Packers win the super bowl. Losing him really changes the whole OL.

Claypool -
I'm also glad they didn't get Claypool. I don't think he would have helped that much to be honest. What they need is to get Lazard, Cobb and Watson back. That will make the biggest difference.

PFF -
I don't like to use them as a reference all the time, but when I do I take it with a grain of salt. Savage had 3 that I can remember off the top of my head.

Bounceback -
Doubs really played good. The one down the field play he should have had imo. But overall he was really good. That TD catch was great.

Toure, Toure, Toure -
Toure deserves more playing opportunities. He needs more looks in the passing game.

Watkins -
I'm taking the 2nd option on this response. When Rodgers was talking about less playing time, i do wonder if Watkins was one of them.

Walker -
The only thing I wondered is if something was said. But I agree. Youthful mistake. It happens. A good learning experience. He has been playing really good of late and we need him to keep playing better.

6 points
7
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jvole's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:21 am

Because of injuries, I get the O-line's troubles but why the interior D-Line stinks is a mystery? Lowry is....ok, but beyond him there are some real athletes. They seem to get the snot knocked out of themselves every week (except Clark, of course).

2 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:17 am

They never play base defense and they never blitz. That means on every single play, the oline has a 5 on 4 advantage and if they have a tight end inline thats 6 on 4. That means Lowry is getting double teamed on virtually every run play. Lowry is a base defense 5 technique. Hes not built to take on 20+ double teams per game. You combat this by playing base and using some run blitzes to keep the front 7 in one on one's but Joe Barry has no aggression whatsoever. Lowry is a good player and hes being misused like so many other players on this roster. For too long, the Packers have played their own version of moneyball where they've completely ignored the run on both sides of the ball. Just pass and stop the pass and we'll win. Well people are finally starting to see that it doesnt matter who the skill players when you just forfeit the line of scrimmage every single play. I've been saying this for years now and it just never changes. Packers are like a boxer terribly afraid to take one on the chin so they just willingly accept body shot after body shot till their ribs are broken and their organs are mush. And on offense, they just go for knockouts and never even attempt the body shot. Give me a coaching staff who emphasizes controlling the line of scrimmage above everything else and you'll see this team change over night. They have the players, what they dont have is a coaching staff with any balls or attitude.

9 points
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Packerpasty's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:31 am

" Joe Barry has no aggression whatsoever. " truth..I've been saying that all year...I get jealous seeing other defense's blitz and be much more aggressive...sure you get burnt once in awhile but you also make big plays..

1 points
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Razer's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:35 am

...Give me a coaching staff who emphasizes controlling the line of scrimmage above everything else and you'll see this team change over night. They have the players, what they dont have is a coaching staff with any balls or attitude...

So true. You need to go back to the 2010 Packers to see the kind of grit that you cite. The Packers are not a win in the trenches team and it is at the root of all of our early playoff exits. This has been a scouting, drafting and coaching deficiency going back to Thompson and now his protege. We are a finesse team. Just ask the Jet's coach.

5 points
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dobber's picture

November 02, 2022 at 12:22 pm

"They never play base defense"

All you need to do is look at the snap counts to know this isn't true.

1 points
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LLCHESTY's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:49 pm

He's wrong about the blitzing too. They don't do it much but they do do it.

1 points
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LLCHESTY's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:49 pm

He's wrong about the blitzing too. They don't do it much but they do do it.

0 points
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Roadrunner23's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:28 am

*Rodgers gotta go! Terrible leader, he was better with Danica!

*It took almost half the season to figure out your two best playmakers on offense?! Criminal.

*Talky CB’s?! Gotta walk the walk and they didn’t.

*Bakhtiari, he good, but for how long?! He gone in the off-season.

*Claypool, he’ll probably kill the Pack for years to come, that’s how it seems to work.

*Doubs & Toure, love these kids, may as well play them a lot at this point, the packers aren’t going anywhere.

*Watkins, was a crappy signing at the time and he is who he thought he was! Gutekunst must have been in Peru drinking the same tea as Rodgers!

*Walker, just another sign the wheels are coming off!

*Time for Rodgers to go (either by trade or retirement)

LET THE REBUILD BEGIN!

-9 points
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Swisch's picture

November 02, 2022 at 08:36 am

Hold on a sec: In Cory's piece yesterday, wasn't Aaron Rodgers portrayed as sounding unenthusiastic about the great success of the running game against the Bills?
Is that not a thing, a big deal?
Our ground game runs wild against the Bills for big chunks, but Rodgers seems to question if that's the way the offense wants to play, adding that it needs to take shots downfield.
To quote Cory, "The Packers finally did something meaningful on offense and Rodgers wants to do something different."
***
So, not only is Rodgers apparently saying that he isn't interested in doing what worked so well against the Bills, he is also attempting to undermine and override his head coach once again by diminishing and dismissing this strategy that actually worked.
If I'm accurate in this assessment, then that means the continuing arrogance and intrusiveness of Rodgers means continuing dysfunction and decline for the Packers.
How is this not a huge story, the most important news of the week for the Packers?

-3 points
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Guam's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:00 am

Good points Swisch!

I have long suspected that Rodgers and LaFleur are at odds over the offense (and LaFleur caved to Rodgers and has been running Rodgers' preferred offense). Shanahan's offense has always favored the run and Rodgers prefers to sling the ball. If you have great WRs, I understand a HOF QB wanting to throw it. However with the current WR/TE group, running the ball makes sense. It remains to be seen what the offense will look like going forward despite the success of the running game in Buffalo (against the #1 rushing defense in the league).

1 points
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coolhand's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:11 am

I agree with ARod. You have to go downfield to win in this league. The running game would be even more effective if the Packers can show they have the downfield threat.

9 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:26 am

You win in this league by scoring points and theres more than 1 way to do that. Rodgers is just an old dog whos not interested in any new tricks and thats why this team is failing. Passing numbers are down around the league because defense are flat out refusing to let receivers get behind them. Teams with better receivers than the Packers arent doing crap in the pass game because of it. Some teams are adapting to this by running the ball and dictating to defenses and others (like Rodgers and the Packers) are just doing the same old thing expecting it to work. Something has to give. But Rodgers would rather throw and lose than hand it off and win. Hes not shy about it either. He has to go.

-1 points
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Packerpasty's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:34 am

hmmmm...seems to me he handed it off fairly often against the Bills...what gives with that hey, but once again to some its all Rodgers fault...all of it...must be a very influential player!!

2 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

November 02, 2022 at 04:16 pm

That was 1 game and they were already deep into the 2nd quarter by the time they started running consistently. Who knows, maybe if they come out running from their first drive it may have been a different outcome. Regardless, the run game on sunday is the high point of the season for this offense so far.

0 points
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croatpackfan's picture

November 02, 2022 at 10:40 am

Swisch & RTS - both are coloring in vain!

-1 points
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Coldworld's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:40 am

I agree on that too, though it’s a question of how and the run is both our greatest asset and the way to set up play action. We have done the RPO largely to death. It in fact also works much better when Ds are not just sitting in the area and have to deal with vertical threat.

We went into this year with a ludicrous game plan that I’ve often said was self defeating. We refuse to run route patterns that are not excessively conservative. We don’t trust the rookies to help or provide help to others by drawing coverage. We settle back into running and passing into the same areas. It doesn’t work. I’d go as far as to say it never has consistently for any team.

LaFleur had made a total hash if this O. Already challenged, he gave it no chance through its design. Part of the reason, I believe, is he is incompetent, but it’s also fair to say that Rodgers attitude to rookies and lack of familiarity with them may have been a driver.

What is certain is that, for the most part we do better when the O call breaks down and players get into the intermediate or long zones. Rodgers looks better and our receivers do too. We now need to play those who can get open and not worry about drops/mistakes, just keep running and feeding them in between through play action.

Our O line was not great last game, but Rodgers had enough time, partly because of the run. In the prior game he had plenty of time but the O calls prevented capitalizing. We just threw into heavily contested short windows m: low success and high risk in fact and pointless. Jones’s TD would have been that too, but he broke out when a defender sat in the target point.

The laFleur O design this year is pointless and futile caution gone mad. Gutless. For all the issues with Rodgers, real and imagined, this team is less bad left too him alone than with LaFleur. If anyone wants a window into why we got as far as Rodgers alone could take us, this season is screaming it.

2 points
4
2
T7Steve's picture

November 02, 2022 at 10:20 am

Wouldn't it help and be nice if the WRs could get open in the mid-range? All short passes or long shots are hard to survive with too.

3 points
4
1
Nate-1980's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:11 pm

That would fall on the gm getting washed up old guys and depending on rookies and thinking it will be fine with a great but aging qb..Rookies make mistakes, old guys can’t get separation, it’s really not hard to understand why our offense is garbage.. Murphy is top to blame because he hired from within the organization, he hired a guy with no previous experience as a gm that is now so far over his head he doesn’t know if he builds for the future or goes all in.. Then in essence does neither and contradicts every other move he makes.. It’s like people have a case of “loser denial” with this dolt, I’ll never get that thinking.. If he’s such a good gm, I’d bet you all 100 bucks he doesn’t sniff another gm job again after this ludicrous attempt at job competency.. ZERO OFFERS A COMING, again, tell me I’m wrong..

0 points
2
2
Razer's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:25 am

I heard Rodgers post game indicate that they need to push the ball down field. Running the ball opens up the downfield pass as evidenced by the Doubs and Toure TDs. Running alone isn't going to win in this league and he is right. Pull the defense closer to the LOS and burn them with some well disguised pass plays. Until our O-line starts to play well and a couple of WR step up, we are a partial offense that poses little downfield threat.

11 points
11
0
Houndog's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:27 am

Don't I remember a couple "shots downfield' during the Bills game being under-thrown or 5 yards over the head of receivers?
Am I dreaming, or haven't we seen a good amount of that this year?

7 points
7
0
Swisch's picture

November 02, 2022 at 06:33 pm

As written above by Jersey Al, a strong running game will tend to set up the deep passes.
I'm all for the deep passes. If they're open, throw them all the time for long and exciting and productive plays.
The thing is that it's usually not that easy. It seems most often the running game sets up the passing game.
In any case, the offense needs to both play to its strengths and to take advantage of the weaknesses of the defense.
Whether that's mostly run or mostly pass may change from game to game, and quarter to quarter. Also, it's how a team runs the ball and how it passes the ball, not just doing it dutifully and dully.
Unfortunately, the Packers offense this season seems to be neither imaginative nor adaptable.
***
Main issue though is Rodgers apparently being insubordinate in his recent comments, which no one has even tried to refute thus far in the replies.
It seems similar to the Lions game last season. When the Packers clinched the top seed for the playoffs, it seemed obvious to rest the starters against the Lions in what was a meaningless game in the standings at the end of the regular season.
What apparently took place, though, as best I recall, was Rodgers publicly announcing that he and the starters should play in that game -- and this before his head coach had a real opportunity to decide the matter.
So, if true, LaFleur was put in an extremely awkward position of either going along with Rodgers or having to contradict him as the superstar quarterback. Not fair!
(By the way, we lost both Bakh and MVS to injuries against the Lions so that they weren't available for the playoff game two weeks later -- which the Packers lost, anyway, in a poor showing for the offense despite its work against the Lions.)
***
Now, it seems Rodgers is interfering with the head coach once again by basically saying he doesn't want to go with the running game that was implemented for the Bills game with such great success (presumably under the direction of his head coach).
He could have kept that to himself, or talked with LaFleur privately about it, perhaps working out a compromise, but instead Rodgers seems to have once again challenged the authority of LaFleur in a very public way. (Another example would seem to be Rodgers speaking out about not wanting to play in the preseason instead of conferring with his coach behind the scenes.)
This latest incident of speaking defiantly is the last straw for me.
I've been hoping in my comments of late that Rodgers would come around to being more coachable, and the emphasis on the running game against the Bills could have been evidence of Rodgers doing just that in a change of attitude for the better.
Instead, Rodgers seems to be making it clear that he doesn't like the way the offense ran the ball against the Bills in reckless disregard of his head coach.
So, enough is enough. At the halfway mark of the season, I'd bench Rodgers as selfishly subversive to the good of the Packers.
***
P.S. As to the concerns of Coldworld about LaFleur being unable to run an offense, what seems sad to say is that he may never have really tried to do so with the Packers due to the possible resistance of Rodgers all along.

0 points
2
2
Nate-1980's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:22 pm

Rodgers is the only problem ra ra raaa.. Two mvps with Adams and now the whole team is broke, I wonder if that has a single bit of the reality of what’s really happening..

0 points
1
1
Coldworld's picture

November 03, 2022 at 12:32 pm

Swisch, to me it doesn’t really matter if it’s Rodgers blocking it in the end, for two reasons. Murphy has extended Rodgers and thus supported him over the man who he picked personally to bring in an O. In which case under your scenario LaFleur is a mistake by Murphy.

Secondly, if it’s truly Rodger’s O, the motivational, tactical, personnel and coaching hires are his sole tasks and he’s awful at all of them and thus a mistake.

LaFleur was a disastrous pick whichever way one looks at it. The only wrinkle is that your view takes some of the blame for the mess, but not the fact of his unsuitability, off him and onto Murphy as it would indicate he’s really calling the shots more than might be, ultimately.

1 points
2
1
Houndog's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:08 am

The entire season thus far is nothing short of a Shit-Fest, even the games they've won, and there's plenty of blame to go around.
You can blame a coaching staff that has ridden the arm of an aging MVP quarterback to three consecutive NFC championship contenders, three 13 win seasons, and now, not adjusting or sticking with the run game. You can blame an injury plagued, inconsistent, under-performing, and arguably misaligned, out-of-position offensive line. You can blame a (history of not being trusted) young receiver group, and the injuries to the veteran receivers left on the team.
And that's just the offense!
You can also blame Gutey for his hard-headed, somewhat arrogant drafting and free agent selections, and his unwillingness to ever make that 'one big trade' that can change a team.
And then there's the defense, and there's a coaching problem here! Go ahead and give me the thumbs-down for this, but there's enough talent on this defense to be far better than they are, even with the fact we took Quay Walker over Devin Lloyd. The D-backs are a group a number of teams would covet, and yet they get torched far too often, playing 10 yards back. C'mon Man! Alexander talks trash as good as he plays, and sometimes better! Stokes is a talent just waiting to be tapped, and Douglas is Douglas, maybe the best football IQ in the bunch, the safeties need a transfusion and Douglas might be it. The D-line, while not all Pro-bowlers has a new 1st round pick and 'should be' adequate and the LB's should be too. But where's the leader, there hasn't been one since Woodson departed, which is about the time the defense started its decline to being soft.
Someone has got to grab the bull by the horns and it doesn't appear Joe Barry and his staff are capable.
Let the thumbs down begin.

12 points
12
0
Packerpasty's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:35 am

Hold on a minute!!! You mean its not all Rodgers fault...holy spotted cow, amazing insight..

4 points
8
4
Gravedigger93's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:25 am

If they trot Savage out there to start the Lions game that will tell me all I need to know about the coaching...I'm not saying there's someone better, but are the other guys actually worse? Needs to be accountability.

7 points
7
0
Coldworld's picture

November 02, 2022 at 09:47 am

They are trotting out Barry. I wouldn’t get too hopeful.

6 points
7
1
PackyCheese500's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:23 am

Ford has actually been better.

5 points
5
0
jannes bjornson's picture

November 02, 2022 at 02:15 pm

You cannot pay this guy to make a mockery of the position.

0 points
0
0
Leatherhead's picture

November 03, 2022 at 12:41 pm

If we don't start Savage, we'll be starting a guy who throughout training camp, pre-season, and all the regular season practices.....showed the coaches they weren't as good as Savage. I'm not sure that solves anything.

Sometimes, you have to just fix stuff. You can't go to the WalMart and get a better player off the shelf at this point in the season.

0 points
0
0
Since'61's picture

November 02, 2022 at 10:18 am

First, great job AL. As for being ready to play I think the offense was ready to play but the defense didn't get the message until the second half. Four straight scoring drives allowed basically ended the game at halftime. I've asked a few times since Sunday why did it take until halftime for MLF to challenge his team. He should be doing that before the game begins and should be doing that before every game. Check coach Lombardi's approach to preparing for every game.

Run the ball speaks for itself, specifically get the ball to Aaron Jones as often as possible.

On defense the only player who plays up to his level. of trash talk is Alexander. Allen was 0-5 on throws towards Alexander with a pick. The DL can't hold the point of attack and is repeatedly pushed all over the field.

DBAK - had his best game of the season. Hopefully his knee continues to hold up. He is the only OL who we can count on.

Claypool - glad we held onto our pick(s). I agree that he would not make a significant difference.

PFF - I have questioned the PFF model from the beginning. I've seen their model. It produces inconsistent results at best and part of the reason is because the variables in the model can be manipulated. It's OK for the skill players but with limitations. As for OL, DL and defense in general it's unreliable as as far as I'm concerned. Your examples of Savage and P. Smith are excellent examples of why I ignore PFF scores. Not everything that is counted counts.

Doubs can be a good one if we give him the chance. Toure should play more.

Watkins - why is he here? Gute? anybody?

Walker - stupid mistake. Another area where are coaching is lacking. Failure to instill any type of discipline in our players. No discipline, poor attitude, non-aggressive, great job guys.

Bring on the Lions. Thanks, Since '61

9 points
9
0
RCPackerFan's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:39 am

"I've asked a few times since Sunday why did it take until halftime for MLF to challenge his team."
To be fair, these are professionals. Why does it take for the coach to inspire them to play?Why does it take for them to be challenged to play?

"Run the ball speaks for itself, specifically get the ball to Aaron Jones as often as possible."
perhaps we can say they finally are figuring things out on the OL too. There were better run lanes and it looked better overall once they stuck with it. And maybe a little bit of good production for the OL will improve them as well. Something they can kind of hang their hat on.

0 points
0
0
Leatherhead's picture

November 02, 2022 at 10:37 am

I like the rollercoaster, and very much prefer it to the merry go round.

Rodgers comments about it being the first time the energy was right........dude, you are the leader of this team. In every team sport I've ever known, the leader always sets the tone, so even though I hate to say this, but if the energy isn't right, the first place I'd look is the leader.

I take PFF with a grain of salt. At the end of the day, all they're doing is quantifying subjective observations. What constitutes a drop, or a bad route, or a missed tackle isn't chiseled in stone someplace.....there's a lot of gray area.

As far as Offensive Lessons......Run More, Pass Less. Yeah, it's nice to have company on the bandwagon.

Sammy Watkins, Toure, etc.: I'm about to say the Watkins move has failed. It looked like he might be a guy who could make up half of what we lost with Adams, but he hasn't. This is a classic example of what Ted Thompson always said about free agency, that you get a guy who isn't an improvement on what you already had, and that it's easy to make expensive mistakes. Better to draft and develop. Would we be any worse off playing Toure? Maybe as a blocker, but that's about it. I'm not a guy who thinks you need 4 or 5 Superduper WRs on the field, but I think it's damn helpful to have ONE guy who is the straw that stirs the drink and creates opportunities for others. None of the guys we have looks like that guy, and I'd predict we're going to look for one next offseason.

XXXXXX

Take heart, brethren. We have a game in a few days. If we win, we'll be able to talk about getting to .500. If we lose, it'll almost certainly trigger many of the changes we'd like to see. Either way, it's not going to be like it is today a week from now.

6 points
7
1
LeotisHarris's picture

November 02, 2022 at 04:43 pm

Good thoughts per usual, LH. Yeah, I don't dread Sunday at all. It can get disconcerting comparing what is happening at 1265 with what appears to be occurring within the Minnesota NFL franchise. Those goobers haven't won anything yet, and I doubt they will. At best, for a season they'll get to be the worlds' tallest dwarf. Yippee! Print up a bunch a them purple NFC North Champ t-shirts.

Like you mentioned, a loss to Dee-troit will create an interesting environment. I don't see us spiraling into 20 years of woe, but maybe that's just my defense mechanisms at work. It's difficult to like most of these guys right now with their lack of effort, and the coaching staff inspires no confidence.

4 points
4
0
Packerpasty's picture

November 02, 2022 at 05:01 pm

the leader of the team should be the HQ and his staff..if he can't fire them up and get them ready no one can..the QB and other stars are just a support cast, for sure they have input in firing up the team but if MLF and Barry don't do it, it won't get done period...and these two can't do it...

2 points
2
0
Nate-1980's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:35 pm

So let me get this straight LH.. FA acquisitions don’t work because we went to the dollar store and got an old broken toy with Watkins on his back? I don’t see the logic, you get what you pay for.. I just want an answer to why we went from top 5 in the league offensively to bottom third and lost Adams and MVS.. We’ll I’d say they didn’t replace the wr skills, who’s fault was that.. Oh yeah and over his head gm, named Gute..

1 points
2
1
Leatherhead's picture

November 03, 2022 at 12:53 pm

Nate.....

SOME FA acquisitions don't work. Actually, MANY FA acquisitions don't work. I would argue that these high dollar FAs probably work out about half the time.

Joe Johnson. Remember him? Terry Glenn? Jimmy Graham? It's easy to make costly mistakes in FA. That's just a fact.

Secondly, the reason we went to the dollar store is because we have salary cap problems because we kept guys like Bakhtiari, Jones, and Rodgers on the team and we don't have unlimited money.

" I just want an answer to why we went from top 5 in the league offensively ...."

That is a good question Nate. I'm going to try to give it a good answer.

1) Our QB is not playing like an MVP.
2) Our line has not coalesced
3) We've had injuries to our WR unit.

But mostly, I look at the turnovers. After being a top team at protecting the ball, we're 14th right now. If we were averaging even 3 more ppg, we'd be a Top 10 scoring offense. We've had 15 fumbles, although we recovered some of them, and if we had even a few less it would make a significant improvement in our rankings.

IF. IF. IF. this team can stop beating itself with turnovers and inopportune penalties, it can be a pretty decent offense. that's what I think.

1 points
1
0
Nate-1980's picture

November 04, 2022 at 02:25 pm

Some fair points LH, the o line is not playing well, but our wr corps was not strong to begin the season and now they’re injured.. If you don’t think Rodgers main issues with bad play aren’t who's catching the ball I guess we’ll have to disagree.. I think if we still had Adams we’d only have two losses this year..

0 points
0
0
LLCHESTY's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:04 am

The reason the Packers ran the ball so well is the Bills LET them. The Bills had faith that if the Packers were forced to sustain long drives to score they would screw it up. Faith confirmed. They played with light boxes most of the night and got the result they wanted. Good breakdown on how the Bills defended them here.

https://youtu.be/Jq94dTAUbDo

6 points
6
0
LeotisHarris's picture

November 02, 2022 at 04:47 pm

Wow, and Mike Wahle is literally physically half the man he used to be.

0 points
0
0
Leatherhead's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:11 pm

Classic. When other teams run on us, it's because we're no good, but when we run on other teams, it's because they let us. Beautiful.

I've pointed out on numerous occasions that it's better to let teams run for 5 yards per attempt than to pass for 7 yards/attempt. You never seemed to be on board with that reasoning.

IMO, this is yet another example talking out of both sides of ones mouth.

-1 points
2
3
Coldworld's picture

November 03, 2022 at 12:52 pm

That’s pretty much the Bills regular approach. We did far better than others at running on it.

-1 points
0
1
Leatherhead's picture

November 03, 2022 at 01:06 pm

It's pretty much everybody's regular approach, which is what I've said a bunch of times. The best RBs average close to 5.0 ypc; AVERAGE QBs average 7.0 yards/attempt.

Is it better to give up 5 yards per play, or 7? So when people start howling about how pathetic our run defense is, it just let's me know they don't know what they're talking about. We are CHOOSING to focus on controlling the pass and giving up yards on the ground doesn't matter much until we get close to the goal line. We've given up 8 rushing TDs, which is average-ish; we've also given up 8 passing TDs, which is Top Ten-ish.

No doubt, Buffalo focused on controlling the pass and we ran with great success....more success than other teams. But we weren't able to punch it in. But to say we were only successful with the run because Buffalo was "letting us".....that's just nonsense.

1 points
1
0
Handsback's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:10 am

Many have pointed out the Packers were a soft team. They went against an aggressive team and got their behinds beat.
We have seen this all year esp after what Jersey Al pointed out about the defensive backs. Now a team has to see their future decline before they decide a change is needed. I think they see it and are starting to realize where they can be successful.
Why it’s taken so long is an indictment on the coaching staff. They can work that out after the season, but until then you will find out who wants to play football and who just play for a paycheck. That will play out the rest of the season.

I know everyone wants scalps for this season, but this was the route that the front office decided was the best chance to land a SB win with Rodgers. Unfortunately they doubled down on the last two contracts to Rodgers and missed on some of their high picks. The results are in and they are not pretty. Building a better future starts this year. Find out who can play, and start drafting and finding players for the future.

-3 points
1
4
RCPackerFan's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:44 am

"but this was the route that the front office decided was the best chance to land a SB win with Rodgers. "

To be fair, the front office was counting on having the whole group of WR's, and the whole OL the entire season. They weren't counting on Watkins missing as many games as he has played in. Watson missing a lot of games. Lazard and Cobb missing a lot of games.

The injuries have ruined the offense. To be fair the coaching/playcalling hasn't helped, but the passing game is nowhere they expected it to be at this point.

-4 points
1
5
Nate-1980's picture

November 02, 2022 at 07:42 pm

So a great plan was to expect Watkins to not get injured although he’s a walking injury.. You’re right the plan the front office came up with stunk, who’s fault is that? Who gets the players for this team??

1 points
1
0
PackyCheese500's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:35 am

The Packers aren't going anywhere fast this season, but here are some things they could do to maximize what they could get out of their personnel and potentially make the playoffs:

1. Fix the Secondary. Convert Savage full-time to nickel CB. He likes playing there, and is bad as a safety. Put in Rudy Ford at Safety. Move Douglas as the primary starting outside CB opposite Jaire; he's better there. If Ford doesn't work out at Safety, then move Douglas there.
2. Play Toure and Deguara more. We will get healthier at WR soon, but Toure deserves starting consideration in the slot. Deguara has shown potential in the last couple of games, and deserves more pass catching opportunities to see what he can do.
3. More D-linemen. Play with 3 DTs on the field more, not 2, like in the nickel alignment. This will help vs the run. More Slaton and Wyatt (to see what he can do) and less Lowry. Jack Heflin should also be elevated to see what he can do.
4. Run the Ball! Self-explanetory.
5. Use more than 5 O-linemen. This will help the Packers run the ball. On Monday night, I saw the Browns run a play where they had 8 offensive linemen on the field lining up at different positions. This will get better blocking for our RBs, and help us in the red zone. Using O-linemen as TEs also helps. Imagine lining up Caleb Jones or Rasheed Walker as a TE - very interesting what this could do for our offense.
6. Put Keisean Nixon as punt returner as well. Amari needs to go, and Nixon looked nice on Sunday returning kicks

Devondre Campbell also needs to play better, as he's missed a lot of tackles this season. I saw quite a few on Sunday.

1 points
4
3
ricky's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:42 am

There are some big questions to be answered. Is the defense vastly overrated, or is the DC terrible? Why can't LaFleur get this team ready to play? Remember when Z. Smith said after the playoff loss to SF, 37-20? He didn't feel ready to play the game, and that the team didn't seem ready. So they got the ball run down their throats all night. What will it take to get this team ready to play every week? Even Detroit seems more fired up, and they've been terrible for years. The O-line is going to have to undergo some evaluation this off season. Bakhtiari is a rock, but unfortunately, the caveat "when healthy" now has to be added. Is it coaching, or are the caliber of players just lacking? And why did it take so long for there to be changes? And hanging over everything is how long Rodgers is going to stick around. Because once he leaves, the salary cap hit is going to be extremely harsh. This was supposed to be another year of SB contention. Instead, it looks more like dysfunction and dissension, especially between the QB and HC (again).

1 points
2
1
barutanseijin's picture

November 02, 2022 at 04:10 pm

“ Is the defense vastly overrated, or is the DC terrible? ”

Both. Same for the offense.

1 points
1
0
Rarescope's picture

November 02, 2022 at 11:50 am

"Finally Ready to Play"

Last night I watched "A Football Life: Bruce Arians" on Youtube (excellent series, check them out if you haven't!). Anyone who says something along the lines of NFL players are professionals, they shouldn't need to be fired up to play well, yadda yadda yadda needs to go watch that documentary. Along with every other one about a successful coach. Player after player talking about what an impact just wanting to play well for their great coaches was on their game - and seeing the results. All of the great coaches I've watched are:

1. Great motivators
2. Great teachers
3. Great schemers

If you can't motivate them, they won't care what you have to teach. And if you haven't motivated or taught them anything, the greatest schemes in the business won't be enough to win.

5 points
5
0
T7Steve's picture

November 02, 2022 at 12:22 pm

That's one of your best so far! You're a motivated schemer.

0 points
0
0
bjkdad44's picture

November 02, 2022 at 12:49 pm

Joe Barry has no aggression… and… obviously… no teaching skills!!!

2 points
2
0
Dancrothers54's picture

November 02, 2022 at 01:04 pm

I’ve got to say people should lighten up on Walker ! Yes it was an immature reaction but we see this every game every week! Whatever game is played , things happen on the sidelines. Yes he shouldn’t of pushed the guy ,but we don’t know what was said on the sidelines. What I find most egregious is not only a fifteen yard penalty but an ejection! Really !!?? Helmet to helmet,late hits or roughing the quarterback…which are usually worse ,generally don’t warrant ejections

3 points
3
0
HawkPacker's picture

November 02, 2022 at 01:26 pm

I believe the key to the ejection was Walker pushing someone that was not in the game. I was not surprised to see the ejection and actually support it.

3 points
3
0
Dancrothers54's picture

November 02, 2022 at 01:35 pm

Great response! I don’t agree on the ejection but thanks for the strong points!

2 points
2
0
HawkPacker's picture

November 02, 2022 at 05:33 pm

Good response Dan. Much appreciate your positive response on your disagreement!

0 points
0
0
Fubared's picture

November 02, 2022 at 05:54 pm

I disagree with Rodgers sentiment. The team was riled up because it was the first game this year not only were they favored to lose but they were expected to get a beat down.
Hell that will ignite ferver in anyone that you got to fight back.
My two cents, this team is a dumpster fire from top to bottom and the pain your seeing now is just the beginning. Heck your losing five starters next year due to lack of funds and your going to replace them with late round conditionals and drafting to replace some of them.
This is a turnstyle football organization that is in a constant mini rebuild. The draft is one thing, but drafting to replace people who can play football and are experienced with rookies aint working.

-2 points
0
2