Cory's Corner: This Team Remains Incomplete

The Packers offense tallied four three-and-outs against a Titans passing defense that was 31st in passing yards per game. 

Where do the Packers go from here?

After Thursday’s 27-17 loss to the Titans, Green Bay is seemingly in a weird vortex. The Packers have all the makings of a rebuilding team — a young roster that makes plenty of mistakes but they also have a $50 million quarterback.

“Not a lot of margin for error for us and definitely not against a team that gives you some opportunities,” said Aaron Rodgers, who was 24-for-39 with 227 yards and two touchdowns. “We’ve got to have those plays.”

Rodgers is right. We all knew coming into this season that he had to play nearly flawless every game just to give the Packers a chance this year. That’s how starved this team was for playmakers. 

Ever since Rodgers injured his throwing thumb on the last play against the Giants across the pond, his passes haven’t looked all that impressive. He has thrown plenty of passes at teammate’s feet or airmailed it over their heads. In the last six games, Rodgers is 129-for-208 with 1,385 yards, 11 touchdowns and four picks. That is good for a 91.13 passer rating — and one of the main reasons why the Packers are 1-6 in that span. 

Yes, I know that the Green Bay secondary made Ryan Tannehill, the epitome of an average NFL quarterback, look like Joe Montana last night by playing in the same soft zone. Tannehill tallied his eighth 300-yard passing game as a Tennessee Titan simply by finding open receivers. There aren’t a lot of NFL quarterbacks that can’t do that. I mean, he only had five incompletions all night. 

I’ve said it for awhile now, but if Rodgers’ right thumb is forcing him to change his throwing motion or if it’s worse than he’s letting on, coach Matt LaFleur has to do the difficult thing and sit him down. I’ve had Gamekeeper’s thumb and it’s very painful. I cannot imagine what he’s going through when 300-pound defensive linemen fall on it. 

Mathematically, the Packers are still in the playoff race. But the Packers still have to visit Philadelphia, Chicago and Miami. They will host Minnesota and Detroit to close out the season. Even if the Packers go 4-1 in those five, they would be 8-8 and would need to beat the Rams just to finish above .500. 

There are so many things wrong with this team. It has a left tackle that hasn’t been 100 percent healthy in about two years, a tight end that still hasn’t returned to his athletic form, a cornerback that was billed as a top shutdown cornerback but certainly hasn’t shown it this year and a head coach that remains baffled.

“I don’t even know what to say,” LaFleur said after the game. “It was nothing like a few days ago.”

We are into late November now and the head coach of a professional football team still has no idea? That is downright scary. If he doesn’t know what the magic elixir is, why would anybody else?

The margin for error for this team has been razor thin. Yet, it remains very stubborn in its desire to keep doing the same things. Defensive coordinator Joe Barry was brought in to replace Mike Pettine, but unfortunately, Barry’s same bend but don’t break traits look a lot like Pettine’s teams that often didn’t play up to their athletic ability. 

Green Bay is a shocking 4-7. Even with the amount of pressure laid at the quarterback’s feet, that doesn’t make it OK to throw ducks all over the field. Rodgers is the best passer I’ve ever seen, but lately he has looked like just another guy who is more concerned about staying healthy. 

If LaFleur hasn’t reached his team by now, he’s not going to. This game was the perfect litmus test because it was coming off a big win over a Cowboys team that many people thought could compete in the NFC. 

Turns out that win may have just been an aberration. 

 

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Cory Jennerjohn is a graduate from UW-Oshkosh and has been in sports media for over 15 years. He was a co-host on "Clubhouse Live" and has also done various radio and TV work as well. He has written for newspapers, magazines and websites. He currently is a columnist for CHTV and also does various podcasts. He recently earned his Masters degree from the University of Iowa. He can be found on Twitter: @Coryjennerjohn

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Comments (101)

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

November 19, 2022 at 06:26 am

The season is over not even a remote change of making playoffs. Let's not fool ourselves. MLF might be baffled and confused but I don't think Gutey is. I hate constantly hearing about Rodgers thumb as an excuse. Be very easy to go down a rabbit hole discussing reasons why the passing game is under performing. The team needs to sit players and play and develop the young players, which includes playing Love. If Rodgers thumb is that bad than it once again is on MLF when he has a 3rd year #1 round QB sitting there.

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NickPerry's picture

November 19, 2022 at 07:21 am

Well said Knock...But I think we'll have to wait till all the mathematic possibilities of making the playoffs are done. I'd imagine that will be after next Sunday's game vs Philly or the following week, even though we know it's been over for a while.

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Guam's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:28 am

I agree about playing the young guys including Love once the Packers are eliminated from contention, but I wonder if the Packer front office and coaching staff will have the guts to make that decision. You know Rodgers won't like it and it may well sever the relationship between Rodgers and the team (with Rodgers demanding to be traded or cut in the off season).

Are the Packers ready to make that step? It would be a total reversal of Murphy's decision to resign Rodgers last winter (as well as a tacit admission it is was the wrong decision to resign Rodgers). I just don't know..........

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EnemyTerritory's picture

November 19, 2022 at 09:41 am

It would be a brutal reversal of the decision to resign QB1 but if you are a lemming with an iota of a brain then changing your mind r before falling off the cliff is not a bad thing. Some benefits for a trade or retirement include ripping the bandaid off and finally having the decipher to be made leaving clarity of the future. No more continued self flagellation of the same topic. We did this with Favre. Some minor salary cap savings. A chance to see what Love has. Possibly a turnover of some of the aged season ticket holders…?

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Guam's picture

November 19, 2022 at 10:28 am

It would be a brutal reversal of the decision which is why I am starting to believe the Packers won't do it. I suspect they will come up with a half-assed "solution" like playing Rodgers in the first half and Love in the second half with a game plan suited to neither. This would allow Rodgers and Murphy to save face and allow the FO to get some look at Love.

Will Rodgers be happy - probably not. Will an ill-suited game plan help the Packers evaluate Love - probably not. Will Murphy be happy - probably since he won't have to face the decision about Rodgers until the off-season. Change is always tough.

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Coldworld's picture

November 19, 2022 at 04:34 pm

Does anyone really think Murphy is capable of doing the right thing? This is why the President should never be GM.

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Coldworld's picture

November 19, 2022 at 10:54 am

This is where one needs a President to just tell the true GM (Murphy) that they need to face reality and prepare for the season and will be evaluated accordingly.

Of course our President is the guy who created this, so good luck and a clear example of why he should not have been permitted to undo the Harlen structure. I’m afraid that is a pretty damning indictment of the Board as a whole.

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Barnacle's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:31 pm

To Guarantee a malcontent $150,000,000 is most likely an unwise decision. Now that it is proven to be a major blunder, we don’t need a “tacit admission” of stupidity. We will suffer at least a couple more years of salary cap hell for having incompetent leadership.

AR was acting out and doing drugs far before he was awarded a franchise crippling contract.

Lefleur seems like a nice young man. Gute on the other hand seems arrogant far beyond his accomplishments.

We need new leadership and that should start at the top.

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coolhand's picture

November 19, 2022 at 04:52 pm

MLF at first says he doesn't know what to do. Then comes out and blames the players and gives his coaches a pass. That's not leadership.

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barutanseijin's picture

November 19, 2022 at 06:53 am

Before the Thumb, Rodgers was awful in the opener at Minnesota (67 rating). and below average in the Pats game (89 rating). He had good games against the Bears before the thumb and after, against Dallas. He also had half a game of mediocrity vs the Gints before the Thumb and continued to not get the job done afterwards. I question how much the Thumb is affecting his accuracy.

I like that tweet from Steve Palazzolo. I’ve been saying that for years. After Favre, Packer people became obsessed with interceptions, as if avoiding interceptions were an end unto itself. You gotta win, too! If you’re just taking sacks and fumbling, you’re losing just as much as you are with INTs.

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Guam's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:15 am

Thank you barutanseijin! It is not just the thumb. Rodgers has been inaccurate for much of this season - before and during the thumb injury. His best game was against Dallas which was with the thumb injury. It is not just the thumb.

I don't know what has caused Rodgers' decline, but he is simply not throwing the ball as accurately as he has in years past. Even Rodgers finally owned up to it after the Tennessee game saying that he "needs to throw better".

Rodgers is not living up to his contract as the highest paid player in the league. If that doesn't change in the next few weeks, the Packer front office is going to have a major decision to make in the offseason. Do they sign up for the next two years with a QB entering his 40s and in decline or do they take the cap hit next year and start the rebuild? We live in interesting times............

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:26 am

Well said Bar...

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TarynsEyes's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:01 pm

“I like that tweet from Steve Palazzolo. I’ve been saying that for years. After Favre, Packer people became obsessed with interceptions, as if avoiding interceptions were an end unto itself. You gotta win, too! If you’re just taking sacks and fumbling, you’re losing just as much as you are with INTs."

They've been winning, but they haven't been 'WINNERS' since the 2010-11 SB season. Except for the many useless, and proved to be useless, Division Titles and the playoff seeding derived from such.

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NickPerry's picture

November 19, 2022 at 07:15 am

“I don’t even know what to say,” LaFleur said after the game. “It was nothing like a few days ago.”

"We are into late November now and the head coach of a professional football team still has no idea? That is downright scary. If he doesn’t know what the magic elixir is, why would anybody else?"

This from a guy who is the HC of the most iconic franchise in NFL history. Well shit Matt, you're right, it's nothing like it was a few days ago. But is is EXACTLY like it was the 5 previous weeks and also week one.

If any Packers fan still had hope Matt LaFleur was the right HC for the Green Bay Packers moving forward into 2023, THAT comment right there should alleviate ALL DOUBT.

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PatrickGB's picture

November 19, 2022 at 07:28 am

Say what you want about the HC. The players are not executing the plays. Matt has lost a lot of his assistant coaches and key players. Gutie has not hit on some of his draft picks (esp.third rounders) and help is not on the way.

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Coldworld's picture

November 19, 2022 at 10:58 am

When a number of players are not executing and yet have previously, that is unambiguously coaching. That’s his job since he presides over and selects his coaching staff.

It’s no wonder we have the leadership that we do if we keep falling over backwards to defend them on any pretense, even when, as here, think it through and that pretense is damning too.

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TarynsEyes's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:04 pm

MLF is no different from Hackett with the Raiders and his 'Someone has to win' pathetic response.

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croatpackfan's picture

November 19, 2022 at 03:09 pm

Nick and the rest - MLF was picked because he has no balls and he will do whatever is said from the Idiot to do. I remmember his statement to ACR: " Now, do not be the problem!"

What is the meaning of that sentence? He "calm down" ACR public fire on the franchise who take gamble on him and drafted him. The Idiot do not understand that you can not have succetss if you do have shared powers between 2 person. They looks at the game differently. And one has huge ego and another does not have the balls. Players do not know who to listen. And they perform poorly.

It does not matter who requested that shared power over the offense, important is who establish them. At the end - the Idiot!

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PatrickGB's picture

November 19, 2022 at 07:23 am

Rodgers used to have most of his receivers on the same page. They got open. They had sure hands. They came back to the ball when he got out of the pocket and his line would hold up for lots of time. Much of his game is mental and relying on his team to be in sync. Aaron Rodgers is currently playing with a bad thumb. I imagine that it effects some of his throws. Defenses have schemed him for over ten years and often had his number for much of the game. If Aaron has a weak and often errant throw it’s to his check down out of the backfield toward the sideline. Also, he used to run the ball more and teams would have to devote a spy. All these things have added up this year and makes it look like it’s his fault. And in all fairness, some of it is. But, to me, I still believe that with a quality line, seasoned and talented receivers as well as being healthy we will see the Aaron Rodgers of old. But I doubt that it will be this year.

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Guam's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:19 am

Rodgers will turn 40 next season. I wish I was as optimistic as you are about seeing the Rodgers of old again.

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Coldworld's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:02 am

By the time this cap hamstrung roster is strong enough, Rodgers will not be. Optimistically it’s draft and develop now till 2025 if Rodgers stays. When will that sink in to some? This circle can’t be squared. Trying to will only drag us down further.

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:28 am

Relying on Gutedkunst to bring in blue chippers is another trip down haunted lane...

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TarynsEyes's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:08 pm

Unless it's the 2010-11 season, there isn't much point. All the seasons since have the same ending, though achieved from different angles.

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whysoserious's picture

November 19, 2022 at 09:42 am

What you are saying is that if everything is set up perfectly Rodgers will look good and get back to his MVP form. I could get almost any quarterback to win with that recipe. Why pay $50 million to do so?

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:38 am

I recall Rodgers constantly complaining about MVS, ESB, and J'Mon Moore not coming back to the ball. These comments are tiring like an old record. Much like McCarthy and his damn "need to get shoulder pads lower" comments. These WR's are professional players with professional positional coaches. They practice on the field, as well as watch a lot of film. The concept is pretty damn basic! This could have...should have been resolved at OTA's.

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 20, 2022 at 11:43 am

or the receivers are subpar.

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stockholder's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:00 am

Change the Defensive Front. Change the Outcome! The defense of 3-4-4 has got to go. It's been around; way before 2010. And it won't stop anyone from throwing the ball now. It's a injury waiting to happen. It's time for bigger, Bader, DE's. And a Defense that knows how to blitz!
Yes- give me Reggie White again! Put in the Beef, and you'll change the game. The here we go again must stop! This roster will change. But the best change would be: go back to the defense that has beef. That can't be blocked. That won't get pushed around.
And you'll see teammates not give up. The momentum will stay in our favor. And the pressure on the offense will disappear.
Rodgers no longer is the answer? huh??? Bench him??
Danny Etling would be a better solution than Love. We saw that in the pre-season. And since Love has been a poison since drafted.
The bigger mistake would be to bench Rodgers. Rodgers is in the driver seat. The Packers must pay him. So just stop the Love disease.
You got guys that won't get paid. And you can't blame Rodgers or his salary. For their lack of performance!

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barutanseijin's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:40 am

Sure, they should just snap their fingers and put in Reggie White! Brilliant! Are you volunteering to dig him out of his grave?

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Mr_Bill_H's picture

November 20, 2022 at 07:08 am

Gilbert Brown, who else?!!!

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13TimeChamps's picture

November 19, 2022 at 10:01 am

"And since Love has been a poison since drafted."

How in the world has Love been a "poison"? I haven't read anywhere about him making any negative comments about anything. I realize you don't like him as a QB but you don't have to make shit up.

And for the love of pete....learn some basic punctuation skills.

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whysoserious's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:33 am

I love the 4-3 defense. We don't have the personnel to run it right now. We don't have the cap space to sign anyone in the offseason to help so it will have to be done via the draft. No immediate fix for that problem. Saying you shouldn't bench Rodgers because he is in the "drivers seat"? The Packers are not making the playoffs!! Rodgers may not play next year! You have to find out if Love is your guy if Rodgers retires. If he isn't maybe we can draft one.

You must look to the future because this season is not being saved and evaluations should begin.

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stockholder's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:41 pm

Love is on the block. The defense can make the switch. With this front. Wyatt,Clark, Slaton, Reed. OLB P. Smith
Walker. Campbell will be back. Douglass and Alexander at CB. Amos SS. FS - is savage. And I believe his job would be easier.

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croatpackfan's picture

November 19, 2022 at 03:18 pm

I believe you have the block in your head. You are so affraid that Love will success in NFL and that he will unthron your man crush that you can even accept the truth. Only poison on Packers are Mark Murphy and ACR. Incompetence is on coaches and players are in very bad position.

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:41 am

We advocated for 4-2/4-3 looks over the past five years. It would be another story if their D linemen were stout enough to clog up the lanes in 3-4 sets, but they have guys sliding on skates. This guy Barry shows everything that is wrong in the Packertown,LLC chain of command. Watching his intransigent coaching decisions shows the universe what a half-ass operation it truly is.

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stockholder's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:58 pm

P.Smith has to rush. He might be the best reason they haven't switched. Lowry leaving could change things.

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 20, 2022 at 11:50 am

Lowry should be a situational five tech on the pass rush. He starts because they paid him. Remember P.Smith played with his hand-in-the -dirt at Miss. State. He cannot be the SLB that spot goes to Walker. They had all the ingredients to change up the front the past few games, especially with Campbell in the blue tent. The Dallas win presented four and 5 man stacks and they were successful. McDuffie knows the game. 2022 is the sherman show all over again.

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Oppy's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:43 pm

"Danny Etling would be a better solution than Love. We saw that in the pre-season."

Thank you for confirming you don't know what you're looking at when you assess QB play.

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Rebecca's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:04 am

Last week Rodgers was throwing blocks downfield like a true baller and this week: “Rodgers is the best passer I’ve ever seen, but lately he has looked like just another guy who is more concerned about staying healthy.” Doesn’t seem that way to me. If Rodgers looks like he wants to protect his health wouldn’t he just hand it off from the shotgun and throw the occasional bomb to “no one’s gonna catch Watson from behind” because LaFleur is clueless so and you can’t get sacked or knocked down if you’re 3 yards from the action.

“We are into late November now and the head coach of a professional football team still has no idea? That is downright scary. If he doesn’t know what the magic elixir is, why would anybody else?” Don’t you think LaFleur would already be doing what needs to be done if he had a clue? The rest of your complaints and observations are horse burger that’s been chewed over and over each week.

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Rarescope's picture

November 19, 2022 at 09:41 am

“The rest of your complaints and observations are horse burger that’s been chewed over and over each week.“

Lol no doubt! Kinda has to be with the amount of content that gets put out and this is one of Cory’s better efforts. Just not as much fun when there is little bright side to any of it.

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RedRight49's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:24 am

TITANS vs THE TITANIC

The Titans sank the Packers in all aspects of the game and on all levels of coaching.

Tannehill joins a growing list of opponent's quarterbacks who feasted upon the Packer's defensive carcass en route to a win.

How many 1st round draft picks do the Packers trot out onto the field on game day, especially in the defensive backfield, who are often nowhere in a TV camera's angle while opponent's WRs and TEs are catching short, medium and long range passes in wide-open spaces?

Yes, some guys played a great game and were gamers, Quay and Barnes had some great hits and Nixon and Ford play with intensity and grit.

But how the hell can a defense bring all 11 " up to the line " to stop Derrick Henry on a power run near the goal line, then let a receiver slip out into the end zone and catch a JUMPING Derrick Henry pass for a touchdown?

It appears this years' Packer ship has sank to the bottom of management, coaching and top player depths that are as deep if not deeper
then the dismal abyss of the 70s' and 80s.

How fast can the luxury liner that was the Packers' of the past few - now seemingly imaginary - 13 win seasons - continue to sink?

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Rarescope's picture

November 19, 2022 at 09:43 am

Depth is certainly a concern but it is for every team in the nfl. I think attitude and whatever is wrong with Rodgers is the bigger problem than depth.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:55 am

I don't know how much of the problem is coming directly from Rodgers actions, but regardless I believe Rodgers has lost the team. When he was a Superstar and clearly better than everyone else he could get away with behaving the way he does. He no longer is the Superstar. I don't believe things will start turning favorably around until Rodgers is gone. I'd like to give MLF one fill year without Rodgers to properly evaluate him.

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coolhand's picture

November 19, 2022 at 04:46 pm

2 losses in the playoffs will do that, especially the 49er game he was terrible.

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fangirl's picture

November 19, 2022 at 09:21 am

I wrote my letter to MLF today. I listed all the reasons Joe Barry is damaging the Defense. and that I wanted him let go in-season.

I also don't want some of those highly-paid dudes thinking it's time to start planning their trips to Cabo...Jaire, Rasul, Savage, etc.
They need to buy in now, otherwise this will be another reason to slide.

Now, the hard part--who do I write to to get rid of MLF? Mark Murphy? He'll hire the same type.
I really hope GB fans do more than boo.

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Rarescope's picture

November 19, 2022 at 09:47 am

You totally should write Murphy - might even get it posted on Murphy Takes 5 if you’re snarky enough. He usually responds to one zinger to show he’s not afraid to - which I admire.

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fangirl's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:59 pm

I think I'll defer to Coldworld's eloquence.

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Coldworld's picture

November 19, 2022 at 11:09 am

Ha ha. That’s the point, there is no one. That was supposed to be the President but ours decided that he should also become the de facto GM and thus the source of the problem. That’s why that merger should never have been allowed.

You could write to Susan M. Finco, Vice President and Lead Director, but the word I hear is she so far up Murphy’s behind that the letter would have to go through him to get to her.

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BAMABADGER's picture

November 19, 2022 at 03:12 pm

I didn't realize the Packers are that Woke. What's her 40 time? My God, if true, a woman in a power position of an NFL team and her bio states her PR career at that. No wonder we have a Head Cheerleader not a HC. She probably recommended a good eye brow wax esthetician (my wife had to recommend and spell that title) in Green Bay or Fox Valley. She may be able explain the Green Bay Packer's lack of aggressiveness. Now, can she coach a defense?

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Oppy's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:49 pm

You don't write to anyone to get rid of anybody. Because you don't have any power to do so. You don't have any idea of what goes on inside the doors of that business. No more than I do.

I don't like that Murphy apparently tampered with his GM's decision to move on from Rodgers, and set in motion a contract extension that basically has set back the long-term health of this team for 5 years. However, I don't have delusions that my dislike is grounds for people to lose their jobs. That's none of my business.

You wanna yell at the team? Knock yourself out. But the idea that people should be fired because you don't like the way a business is run- a business, that when you get down to it, has no real affect on your life in any truly meaningful way? Holy hell, lady. That's quite an ego you got there.

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fangirl's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:04 pm

Fans have every right to question the competency of this 'business'

It is corrupt and incompetent and MM does not 'own' it.

If fans (share holders)do nothing but boo and complain then that's on them.

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Oppy's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:53 pm

You don't understand how Packers shares work.

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croatpackfan's picture

November 19, 2022 at 03:25 pm

Oppy, she picked up that Ego trip from her idol.

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Rarescope's picture

November 19, 2022 at 04:17 pm

Really Oppy? I’ve seen more than my share of posters here who think that everyone at 1265 Lambeau just can’t wait to read their enlightened comments about things. At least fangirl is taking actual action other than just coming here and complaining everyday. Haters gonna hate I guess.

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Coldworld's picture

November 20, 2022 at 09:18 am

The best form of action might be an open letter to the board members. Although shareholders could in theory band together, in reality the possibility of that is questionable at best. The best means is to embarrass the great and good on the Board by asking them how they justify approval for removing any executive scrutiny over football operations and what they intend to do to rectify it?

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Geezzzhead's picture

November 19, 2022 at 05:49 pm

I don't know u have to write too. That's the worst part.
Should of known 3 years ago in the playoff game.not going for a touchdown. Sad part ,,just like McCarthy by the time we get rid of him it's to late...
All our players seem to get worse the longer their here.
U mean to tell me ,you couldn't tell Nixon was
a better returner then Rodgers. ..
I also know ,i alone could of got Beckham to sign with us last year ..guarantee.

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Swisch's picture

November 19, 2022 at 10:51 am

It turns out that the long and ugly holdout of Rodgers during the offseason in 2021 was likely an indication that he was bored with football, and perhaps struggling with life.
That's sad for him, and for us fans who have rooted for him and care about him; but it's no reason to let him drag down the entire franchise of the Packers and put it to ruin.
It seems almost all of the problems of the Packers emanate from the disordered life of Rodgers (and his enablers within the organization), yet most fans don't seem to get it (with a notable exception being Return_To_Sanity).
The denial doesn't help anyone, including Rodgers.
***
If quarterbacks have so much influence on lifting a team, it seems apparent that they can drag down a team just as much -- especially someone as manipulative and domineering as Rodgers.
The attitude of Rodgers affects everyone from the GM to the ball boy, and all of his teammates on offense, defense, special teams, and the practice squad.
It is a continual source of sadness for me that Rodgers is allowed to persist as a poison to the Packers, and a source of frustration that fans won't recognize him as the source of the problem. It's such a miserable miasma because there's no sign of a fresh atmosphere moving in.
So, I try to step back at times, and then once in a while make my plea to stand up to this prima donna -- hoping for more fans to see that it's not only talent that makes for a top team, but leadership and character.
***
As most of us thought at the beginning of this season, there is plenty of talent on the Packers.
Gute is a very good GM, and LaFleur coached the Packers to a remarkable three seasons in a row of 13 wins.
Even Rodgers himself is still very talented.
It's the dysfunction of Rodgers that has caused his downfall, and which is the cause of increasing dysfunction and frustration within the Packers.
For the past couple of seasons, perhaps longer, he's the culprit in the downfall of the team -- although his enablers share an increasing amount of the blame.
We've seen so many dazzling displays from Rodgers, but all that glitters isn't worthy of the tradition of the Green-and-Gold.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

November 19, 2022 at 12:07 pm

Swish,
Very well said and it can't be more accurate. Sadly, there are those who are so far up Rodgers backside they will never be able to see clearly how Rodgers negatively impacts the team, but also the organization.

My hope is somehow Gutey forces ML to start Love after the Philly game (ML would never have the confidence to sit Rodgers). I believe if given the rest of the season to play Love is going to convince even the biggest Rodger supporters he should be the starting QB in 2023. Sure he will turn the ball over but believe everyone will see the offense becoming more explosive.

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fangirl's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:09 pm

They already know what they have w/Love.
Do you want to see him play the Eagles, the Vikings?
It will be a disaster beyond anything one can imagine.

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Swisch's picture

November 19, 2022 at 02:17 pm

Feature the run, mix in the pass, and give Love a chance.

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croatpackfan's picture

November 19, 2022 at 03:29 pm

And with ACR is poetry? You are watching the disaster of the epic level with ego maniac in the position of power to confuse the team. Yes, ACR! He had QBR 37 something vs Lions. The worst D in the whole NFL. If that is not disaster what is?

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Swisch's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:54 pm

Oops! My reply to you, Knock, is a little below; I misplaced it.
I really appreciate having you here as a fan who gets the deeper issue of Rodgers being the major problem, beside which the other problems of the team seem rather minor.
Indeed, I strongly suspect many of the problems would go away if Rodgers goes away.
The team won't be perfect, but it will be on the rise.
Instead of an agonizing melodrama swirling around our self-centered QB, it would be exciting and fun to follow the Packers again!

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Cwilly's picture

November 20, 2022 at 05:19 pm

Good thing this is a blog. Most fans are not on a Rodgers band wagon like you think. We just think he’s the best option to win. Not Jordan Love. Love had Adams last season in the KC game and showed his potential. I think Rodgers is showing a decline at his age but I also know Love isn’t the solution. I really feel bad for packer fans that think Jordan Love is the next Rodgers. Packers got lucky to go from Favre to Rodgers. Love wasn’t scouted a top 5 pick and to have the talent of Rodgers let alone Favre. When we move on from Rodgers you won’t see Jordan Love as the future qb in Green Bay. Unless we are tanking for picks!

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Return_To_Sanity's picture

November 20, 2022 at 08:05 am

Thanks for the shoutout, Swisch. I am honored to be deemed notable.

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SinceLombardi's picture

November 20, 2022 at 10:52 am

Gutey is a very good GM?? Three great seasons of coaching from MLF??
Gutekunst has screwed this team up with some lackluster drafts.. as for MLF, the guy that lost as the number 1 seed , two years in a row?? And hired Joe Barry and Mo Drayton ??
Rodgers carried both of them ( with Adams and Jones helping)
Seems like the load has become to heavy to carry.

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 20, 2022 at 12:09 pm

Astute observations.

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Swisch's picture

November 20, 2022 at 04:52 pm

To me, the big mistake of both Gute and LaFleur is caving into the demands of Rodgers -- although their responsibility may be lessened if Murphy is requiring them to do so for their continued employment.
It seems both Gute and LaFleur must be doing something right if the Packers won 13 games for three seasons in a row, including a couple of playoff victories -- not an easy stretch of consistency at a high level.
I'd be open to giving them a season independent of Rodgers to see what they could do with the Packers.
If that is next season, then we could see how well Gute's draft picks have developed over a fair amount of time, and how well LaFleur and his staff have coached them up.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 20, 2022 at 11:02 pm

This to me this is the polar opposite of what the Packers of my childhood were. The Team was greater than any one player because it was a team effort and there was only one boss and a great GM. And no way in hell any player would dictate anything no matter how great a talent. What discourages me the most is the dysfunctional organization and how much it's spiraled down after we rebuilt ourselves with Harlan ,Wolf and Holmgren. I can live with the losses on the field but not the character of the organization and it's team. And all self inflicted.

Better times are ahead but who knows when. I'll ride it out.

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Swisch's picture

November 21, 2022 at 09:33 am

Well said, Tundraboy.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 21, 2022 at 11:57 pm

Thanks, Wish we were not in this position, but we can at least enjoy finding out finally what we have in all these new guys and if MLF at least has enough sense to play them.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 21, 2022 at 11:57 pm

GPG

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fangirl's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:06 pm

Rodgers is overly focused on. If he left tomorrow GB would still have a corrupt leadership, incompetent coaching & soft players.

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Since'61's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:39 pm

Your post is without question fangirl and has been proven since the 2010 SB win. See my post below. It's easy to blame Rodgers because he is the focal point of the offense and it makes it simpler for the haters to focus on one person rather than to see and understand the larger and longer term picture.

While I agree that Rodgers has not played well this season he does not play alone and he doesn't coach the team or hire the coaching staff or sign and draft players but then again why pay attention to all of that when it's so easy to blame Rodgers for everything. But here we are. Stay well. Thanks, Since '61

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Oppy's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:56 pm

Rodgers interferes with the coaching.

It's that simple. He tampers with the dynamics. He ignores his HC, he is defiant. He tells players to not listen to their position coaches. He manipulates the media to make it appear he is not making decisions he is indeed making at the LOS. It goes on and on.

Maybe the dysfunction subsides if the most dysfunctional part of the team goes away. This isn't uncommon in the workplace.

The problem is, nobody wants to confront the ever present evidence that Rodgers is a complete nightmare.

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Since'61's picture

November 19, 2022 at 07:29 pm

All of that is a convenient theory but where are the facts that support Rodgers ignores his HC or that he interferes with the coaching? Which players has he told not to listen to their position coaches and when did he tell them to do so? I'd be happy to read the articles that provide proof from creditable sources that Rodgers has told players not to listen to their coaches or that he interferes with the coaching.

And you are correct there is dysfunction in the workplace but almost without exception the dysfunction is usually due to poor management such as poor hiring practices, poor training, poor/inconsistent communications, lack of supervision, unequal treatment of personnel, and other factors that are too numerous to discuss here. The bottom line is that core reason(s) for the dysfunction needs to be identified and comprehensively addressed.

If in fact Rodgers is actually responsible for what you are alleging and the Packers management and/or coaching has not addressed it they have absolutely no one to blame but themselves. In fact they should no longer be in their current roles in the organization. From what I've observed with the Packers over the last decade plus, as a Management Consultant, I believe the Packers dysfunction begins with Murphy and goes all the way down into the practice squad. Bottom line, dysfunction at the top results in dysfunction on the field. Rodgers may contribute to it but he is a symptom of a bigger problem with the Packers.
Thanks, Since '61

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Coldworld's picture

November 20, 2022 at 12:56 pm

He is a symptom that became part of the cause perhaps. Regardless if that, he carried our teams as far as he could, which was farther than LaFleur could by miles. Again, though that is immaterial at this point. The reality is that Rodgers and this team is a union that has run its course for myriad cap, contract and interpersonal reasons.

It’s over. It was after last year. The decision to return was totally illogical and has led to the wider underlying issues coming to the surface. Rodgers and the Packers just need to find a way to divorce for both their sakes before either can start the upswing.

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Oppy's picture

November 20, 2022 at 07:38 pm

Been here a long time, as you know, and I've spent a lot of time pointing people to the supporting facts for my conclusions. Unfortunately, most ignore it. It is also unfortunate that most of the media, specifically post game and locker room interviews, that contain supporting evidence for my conclusions is controlled by the Green Bay Packers and tends to be edited or evaporate quickly when it contains information not flattering to the GBP or, specifically, the face of the franchise Aaron Rodgers.

I can only assure you I have seen the proof and have reported it accurately over the years. I can assure you, for instance, that Equanimeous St. Brown told the press during a locker room interview that Rodgers tells him to ignore the techniques he's being taught by the coaches and do it his way, but then his coaches get mad and punish him by not putting him on the field. But if he does what the coaches say, then Rodgers simply won't throw him the ball (MVS minutes later seemed to confirm ESB's statements but was saavy enough not to be specific.). That happened. I watched it. Within 2 days, I could no longer find the clip. That's a single example.

It saddens me that for all the years I've been here, you seem to be implying I could just be making it all up.

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Swisch's picture

November 20, 2022 at 08:00 pm

Thanks for the interesting example, Oppy, and I look forward to more of what you have to say.
As fans, we can help each other to get to the bottom of things -- whether it confirms our opinions, goes against them, or some of both.
In the process, we can all refine what we believe and get closer to the truth.
Even better if in the rough-and-tumble of good debate, we grow in camaraderie along the way.

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Swisch's picture

November 20, 2022 at 05:19 pm

From what I've read from fans here at CHTV, Murphy at the very top of the organizational ladder may be just as much of a problem as Rodgers, as the one forcing Rodgers upon the Packers.
I don't know if Gute and LaFleur have happily gone along with keeping the temperamental and intrusive Rodgers, or resisted but relented.
In any case, it seems to me the problem starts with Rodgers, especially from the time of his huge holdout of 2021, in which he held the Packers, and us as fans, hostage to his personal whims.
I admit that I'm proposing a theory about Rodgers, but I think there's a lot of evidence to back it up -- which has been written about by myself and other fans here at CHTV over a long period of time.
***
A couple of examples that seem strong: It appears it's Rodgers who has called the shot about him not playing in the preseason as unnecessary for the preparation of the offense as a whole; but then he seemed to call the shot about wanting to play in the meaningless game against the Lions at the end of the last regular season -- even though the top seed for the playoffs was locked up, and by his own logic it was unnecessary for the preparation of the offense for the playoffs.
True, we don't know if this is what LaFleur would have decided, anyway; but it seems in both cases Rodgers made his intentions known before his head coach even had voiced his views -- which put the latter in an awkward position of having to go along with his outspoken QB to get along, or to go against his wishes in a way that would reveal a clash of wills.
In other words, this seems to show Rodgers as slyly manipulative to get his way by preempting LaFleur with public pronouncements -- even though the reasoning of Rodgers about skipping the preseason but playing against the Lions doesn't seem to be consistent.
After all, Rodgers claims the offense can get ready for games with just practices, so meaningless games aren't necessary. The Lions game was indeed meaningless, and also risked injury to Rodges as his major toe injury was healing, or just healed.
Also, in that game against the Lions, Bakh and MVS were injured and thus unavailable for the playoff game against the 49ers. I wonder if they would have played against the Lions if Rodgers hadn't played.
Then, of course, the Packers offense sputtered against the 49ers, anyway, in a devastating loss to end promising hopes of a Super Bowl trophy.

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Since'61's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:32 pm

I have a news flash for Cory. This Packers team has been incomplete since the 2010 SB victory. The defense has never been the same since the combined losses of Cullen Jenkins, Nick collins and Charles Woodson. Even now with 7 #1 draft picks on defense the Packers are no where close to a dominating defense. They continue to give up easy TDs after our offense scores to make a game close or to take a lead. It just happened twice in this latest loss to the Titans.

On the offensive side the Packers went numerous seasons without a legit Rb threat until we drafted Aaron Jones and followed up with Dillon. But now the receiving corps is basically PS and retirement avoidees except for Watson who is coming on strong during the last 2 games.

The Ol has been good and even very good but never dominant especially against strong DLs like the Bucs, 49ers and lately the Titans DL.

The point is that much of the incompleteness of the Packers starts with Murphy, down through the GM and the coaching staff. Murphy likes to make the headlines by jumping in to re-sign Rodgers and proclaim that "We're not idiots." While the GM seems to have no sense of urgency to add quality players to the roster as the starters go down and the coach tells us that he "doesn't know what to say." what he is actually saying is that he and his coaching staff have no idea what to do or why this is happening because everything worked before and we were 13-3 and 13-4. He hasn't figured out that our opponents have figured out what to do against our soft defense and our alleged "illusion of complexity." Meanwhile our QB is still expected to carry the team with a Practice Squad receiving corps, a badly battered OL, a defense that can't get off the field and STs where literally anything bad can happen and usually does at once or twice per game. Not to mention his injury.

Basically we are watching what this team would have been if Aaron Rodgers had not been the Packers QB since about the 2014 season.

for those who want to sit Rodgers either now or after the Eagles game the Packers would be telling the rest of the team and their fans that we have given up on the season. Once that happens many of the team's veterans will start to take plays off and be playing not to get injured, especially the players who have recently been re-signed like Clark, Alexander, Jenkins and a few others. Why should they risk their careers when management and coaching have given up on the season.

As for Love if the team had any confidence in him they should have sat Rodgers for a week or 2 by now to enable his thumb to heal and get him healthy for what might still have been a playoff run if Love had actually played well enough to win a couple of games while Rodgers was out. Now I doubt that Rodgers will sit at all and he will probably want to return next year at least to make one more statement that he can still play at a high level rather than go out after an awful 2022 season.
Thanks, Since '61

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bjkdad44's picture

November 20, 2022 at 08:29 am

I’d like to know the reasoning for the two down votes?!?!?

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Coldworld's picture

November 20, 2022 at 09:24 am

Well it could be the idea that the team would have benched Rodgers before we are eliminated if they though Love was good. That’s just not realistic and would immediately pose the question of if we though Love was that ready what the heck reasonable was there for signing that albatross of an extension with Rodgers?

As to the team not being complete, I’d largely agree, but say not since Murphy allowed Ball to tryout as GM and cover TTs decline from 2015.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 20, 2022 at 11:05 pm

Me too. Great post 61!

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 20, 2022 at 12:12 pm

When he low-balled Cullen Jenkins, you knew the ship had sailed...

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Swisch's picture

November 19, 2022 at 01:45 pm

That sounds like a good plan, Knock, to put Rodgers on the sidelines, even on the inactive list.
Though we have to pay Rodgers, we don't have to allow him to continue to drag down the team.
In other words, it was a monumental mistake to sign Rodgers at all, especially for massive money largely guaranteed; but it would be even worse to stick with him for that reason and allow him to do even more damage.
It's time to see if we can turn things around with Love, as well as to see if LaFleur has a more creative offense up his sleeve that has been hindered by stubbornness from Rodgers.

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Dragon5's picture

November 19, 2022 at 05:32 pm

Anyone with any business / investment acumen knows a successful organization starts at the top. This is my take...PROVE ME WRONG.

Mark Murphy--a glorified real estate developer whose role is franchi$e $u$tainability

Brian Gutekunst--a "coin-flip" aggressive GM that has yet to field a complete team roster; his "one-way" draft strategy (only trades up) has wasted countless mid-round picks, utterly failed in round 3, has failed to acquire draft capital by mispricing talent relative to consensus draft grades. Love, Dillon, Walker, Gary, Amari Rodgers. His draft history lies here: https://packerswire.usatoday.com/lists/packers-draft-history-picks-gener...

Matt LaFleur--beta male; NOT a leader of men, crumbles when faced with adversity, sideline cheerleader that can't make necessary "tough" decisions that pedigree leaders display, like hiring, firing, benching, etc. Judging by the Tennessee performance, he sure inspired the team four days prior when he cried in the locker room after the Dallas victory; some players were clapping but it seemed like they felt...sorry for him.

PROVE ME WRONG

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Since'61's picture

November 19, 2022 at 07:11 pm

You're not wrong. I've consulted with 68 of the Fortune 100 companies and it always starts at the top. This is why I've been posting that Murphy's decisions (including hiring MLF after one interview) are the primary reasons for the Packers current situation. As soon as I heard him proclaim that "We're not idiots" I knew that Murphy was making major decisions at the player level, specifically in re-signing Rodgers to his current contract extension.

When CEOs make a comment like that they are reminding their people, in case anyone has forgotten, that they are in charge and that they are making the decisions in case anyone has a problem with it. They're basically saying, "Damn the torpedos, full speed ahead". I've seen this scenario numerous times over my career.

We'll never know how much Murphy has been involved with player related decisions. But here we are. And if anyone is looking for the guy look no further than Mark Murphy. Thanks, Since '61

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 20, 2022 at 12:20 pm

He cannot be leveraged by the "stockholders."

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fangirl's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:43 pm

Right on Dragon5.-Wow. You delivered the truth straight up.

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Houndog's picture

November 20, 2022 at 07:46 am

Hit the nail on the head, Dragon 5, and the same for Since '61 and Fangirl.
When they hired MLF they touted him as some brilliant young offensive mind, yet they added Rodgers to the equation to make sure the two could coexist, I knew then it was trouble.
Murphy has single-handedly destroyed everything Bob Harlan built, I've been screaming that for years, and that's a sad situation.
When will the BOD step up and get this back to being what it was meant to be, A Football Corporation?

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CheesedDeadHead's picture

November 19, 2022 at 07:35 pm

I thought it was spelled I-N-C-O-M-P-E-T-E-N-T

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stockholder's picture

November 19, 2022 at 08:01 pm

This team needs Clark to step up. Savage is a problem. Draft Fix- Antonio Johnson Texas A& M- Should be Gutey's choice. There are so many Good TEs later in the coming draft, you won't need to pick one early. And a Wrs in rd. 1 would be a mistake. The Target in Rd. 2 has to be Rashes Rice smu Wr. Only! ( If Gutey wants to dump the vets. ) IF Mike Morris DE or Chris Smith S Georgia fall. Gutey will hit his 3rd.

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 20, 2022 at 12:27 pm

Let's hope Gutey doesn't get to make any calls on the HR side of things in '23. Savage should be benched, now.
In a status quo operation, expect to regress further.

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fangirl's picture

November 19, 2022 at 09:10 pm

The great Peter Drucker, visionary management consultant said (paraphrasing). ''The leader of any industry needs to operate with
complete integrity'.

Anything less will cause rot/failure.

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Houndog's picture

November 20, 2022 at 07:27 am

“I don’t even know what to say,”
Geez Matt, how about this?
"After tonight's fiasco, Joe Barry has been let go as defensive coordinator. We'll choose an interim replacement over the next few days."
That alone would have satisfied a number of fans.
I keep logging in daily, waiting for the announcement, WTF? He should have been fired in the tunnel exiting the field.

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Coldworld's picture

November 20, 2022 at 09:32 am

Thus team didn’t fire Drayton. It’s not going to happen under LaFleur.

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Starrbrite's picture

November 20, 2022 at 10:09 am

Right—-they wouldn’t fire the most incompetent ST coach in the history of the universe.
The Packers hierarchy and coaching staff are a complete clown show.

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Fubared's picture

November 20, 2022 at 10:35 pm

Barry is Gutt's guy. Cant let him go or Gutt will come under the microscope and the brass doesnt want that because Gutt was their pick.
No its easier to look around for blame and find nothing. Finding no blame is the answer to solving problems that dont exist right?
Its just bad luck. Its just injuries. It just new guys making mistakes but hey other then that all is good. Except the freekin w-l record

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BirdDogUni's picture

November 20, 2022 at 03:00 pm

From the second Mark Murphy instituted his new "structure" this team headed into the crapper.

Gutey isn't a terrible GM, but he has little to no power. Gutey is hamstrung and will be until this joke of an organization hires a President whose "only" desire is to win championships.

The new President needs to hire a new GM, one not brought up in TTs system of trying to outsmart himself by drafting no name or small school guys instead of talent from the big power schools of the country. A GM who'll hire scouts that actually know what they're doing. A GM who doesn't trade away picks to move up for failures. If you're going to trade away picks, trade them for proven NFL talent.

A GM who will hire a HC who has a vision for the whole team: Offense, Defense, and Special Teams. (Maybe MaLF could be that guy if he can actually learn from his past mistakes?) (IDK...)

I have no doubt we need a new DC. Barry is terrible at game planning and getting the most out of his defensive talent. Can't see him calling a good game unless he bumped his head.

Everything starts at the top. Mark Murphy needs replacing and I'm not sure who has the power to do that! Not sure anyone does.

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jannes bjornson's picture

November 20, 2022 at 05:24 pm

It all starts with the Fans. They pay for the tickets and merchandise. All successful social movements begin with boycotts.

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Fubared's picture

November 20, 2022 at 10:24 pm

One thing about this team, every year they have a small hoard of players who we have developed that get crap or no offers and go elsewhere. We did a fine job of preparing them for someone else.
Draft and development is cheap ball plain and simple and its the only thing a small market team can really do.
Now strap your ass with the need to have one person who can make this team look good and give that person 50 mil per year and screw all the other players, hey the fans wont notice right.
Z Smith was pissed, went to the Vikes to get even. Packer Org screwed him royally.
I mean with all these picks in the 5,6,7 rounds and you cant like other team bundle these suckers and move up into the second and third and get talent is cheap ball.
Thus, this team is in rebuild mode every year. How the hell can a 7th rounder make your team? How can a 5th, 6th and 7h rounder make your team and start? No other team is doing this.

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