Packers Question of the Day: What Changes Need to be Made?

Mike McCarthy, Dom Capers, Ted Thompson.

Who is it?

According to Twitter and other social media platforms that allegedly have knowledge that weighs far beyond the common fan, all of them have to go.

What say you? What changes have to be made to ensure the Packers' 2018 season ends the way it's supposed to?

__________________________

Zachary Jacobson is a staff writer/reporter for Cheesehead TV. He's the voice of The Leap on iTunes and can be heard on The Scoop KLGR 1490 AM every Saturday morning. He's also a contributor on the Pack-A-Day Podcast. He can be found on Twitter via @ZachAJacobson or contacted through email at [email protected].

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Comments (72)

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Roadrunner23's picture

December 21, 2017 at 08:38 am

1. Ted Thompson needs to finish this draft and settle into a role as Head of Scouting. Ted excels at scouting and it is what he loves to do.
2. Promote either Wolf of Gutenkunst to GM, a young dynamic GM is needed, one with fresh ideas and a GM who will address the media in a coherent manner more than twice a year.
3. McCarthy needs to be extended, he is one of the best coaches in Packer history, but he needs a strong GM to keep him accountable.
4. Fire Dom Capers and the entire Defensive Staff! This is long overdue, it's time!

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jeremyjjbrown's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:07 am

Not sure I would extend Mc at this time but otherwise I agree.

However, I would fire Capers now and see what Winston Moss can do for 2 games. They carried him as Assistant HC for all this time, must be a reason for it.

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:02 am

I have thought the same thing. I know McCarthy wouldn't do that for respect of Capers.

Perhaps he could have him call the defense?
Just like I would also have Bennett call the offensive plays.

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jeremyjjbrown's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:14 am

That works too.

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:01 am

Wow. I was going to say virtually the exact same thing...

well done!

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GBPDAN1's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:37 am

I pretty much agree, nostradanus. Especially the we need a new GM part ! Not one player in the pro bowl and 2 DBs that TT let go made it.

Also, reading articles lately and the dismal stats that our D has produced (not that I had to read any of this as it's all obvious watching our D play) only confirms the poor job TT and DC are doing. They both should have been shown the door 4-5 years ago. We'd have another SB had this happened.

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mrtundra's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:06 am

Screw the Pro Bowl! I don't want that to be the bellwether of success for the Packers. I think most of the blame for the D play falls on Capers. He runs the D and has taken talented players TT has given him and wasted them, IMO. I'd promote TT to head of scouting, if we move him at all. Either Wolf or Gutekunst at GM would be a good choice to fill TT's vacancy, if he leaves that job.

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Leo Smith's picture

December 22, 2017 at 12:43 am

Isn't it time for we Shareholders to revolt and run a new slate of Directors next summer?

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TXCHEESE's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:57 am

Nostradanus nailed it. I even OK with Thompson hanging around for a little while longer, as long as we don't lose our personnel folks over it. Getting rid of Capers would go a long way in correcting what ails this defense. Get rid of all the goofy concepts and let players do what they do best. I bet half the veterans roll their eyes when Capers introduces his new package for the year, which is just last year's fruit cake renamed.

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Pauly's picture

December 21, 2017 at 11:17 am

Also,, give McCarthy a strong role in the Draft and FA process. He should be able to have the type of players he believes will work for his schemes.
Works well for Patriots so far!!

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Pauly's picture

December 21, 2017 at 11:21 am

I think replacing TT as GM is important. Draft and grow is important, but so is strategic FA gap filling.
I have been saying for years I think Murphy and TT are only playing to make the Playoffs on the cheap..... Saving money,, all for the purpose of benefiting the city of Green Bay as a tourist destination. Look at the energy put into "TitleTown".
I think it's possible to do both,,,, with a few key FAs, a better D Coordinator, Rodgers may have won more playoff games and even SBs. Or at least not have been so embarrassed in some of the last play off games.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 22, 2017 at 08:30 am

Sigh, Pauly. 5 likes, too. Putting $ and energy into Titletown has nothing to do with spending on FAs or players. You can only hold your opinion if you don't know the facts and don't know how things work. GB is in no danger of failing to spend 95% of the cap on a three year rolling basis. It does not rollover large amounts of cap space. 65% of our $10M cap space comes from cutting Sitton, something that wasn't in the FO's master plan. GB spent 99.01% of the cap in 2016, and is just over 97% of 2017.

The problem isn't how much GB spends on players or FA, it is how wisely they spend it.

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Mojo's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:38 pm

I agree we need fresh blood at the player procurement level. However, caution is recommended in hiring from within since we don't know who of the current staff is pushing players like Khyri Thorton, Carl Bradford, Kyler Frackrell or Jason Spriggs.

It could be that some of our hot up-and-coming scouting staff is poor at talent evaluation. We don't know because they would never tell us. Sure Ted signs off - but in great part he relies on his scouts and football ops guys. I just want to make sure we don't go from the frying pan into the fire.

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Christopher Gennaro's picture

December 21, 2017 at 05:02 pm

Just going to comment on point one, I agree with TT setting up the draft and then taking another job in the scouting department. My only concern, is letting him draft it, I get that it's going to happen anyways. Its just in this draft they can not afford to miss. Add to the 11 picks, this may the one draft since 2009 where he has the capital to move up in any round. If 2009 Ted shows up sure let him lose. Just not sure what TT going to show up, trading up TT or trading down to get move later round picks. Oh yeah I said I wasn't going to comment on the other points, but 4 needs to happen. Hope everyone has a great Christmas and Happy Holidays

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carlos's picture

December 22, 2017 at 05:56 am

Couldn’t have said it better. You’re spot on. On his last draft there should be more input from the new GM.

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JRome Coaxum's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:25 am

Ted has to go because of his terrible drafts. And not knowing when the trend of player types is changing from generation and constantly drafting 5'11" CB with marginal speed. Also trying to always draft players for 2 position and all this hybrid crap. Where if you draft a good enough S you keep him there. Ex. Micah Hyde. Now he messing up Jones and Ty Montgomery.
Dom has to go because his scheme is crap. He thinks a fancy name to a personnel such as Nitro or Bat really makes the scheme good. He is old as crap. And scheme outdated. As well as him thinking he can just plug a S at CB or a DE to OLB(3-4).
Fire McCarthy for allowing this Capers fiasco to go on for so long. If we fired Capers 3 years ago and we didnt make offs bc off shitty D. Then we would know it was TT at that point. But we dont. Because Mike has sat on his hands for too long .

In the End. Fire them all. Switch scheme back to 4-3

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JRome Coaxum's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:25 am

Ted has to go because of his terrible drafts. And not knowing when the trend of player types is changing from generation and constantly drafting 5'11" CB with marginal speed. Also trying to always draft players for 2 position and all this hybrid crap. Where if you draft a good enough S you keep him there. Ex. Micah Hyde. Now he messing up Jones and Ty Montgomery.
Dom has to go because his scheme is crap. He thinks a fancy name to a personnel such as Nitro or Bat really makes the scheme good. He is old as crap. And scheme outdated. As well as him thinking he can just plug a S at CB or a DE to OLB(3-4).
Fire McCarthy for allowing this Capers fiasco to go on for so long. If we fired Capers 3 years ago and we didnt make offs bc off shitty D. Then we would know it was TT at that point. But we dont. Because Mike has sat on his hands for too long .

In the End. Fire them all. Switch scheme back to 4-3

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badaxed's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:26 am

There are planes, trains and automobiles leaving Green bay every day. They all need to be leaving.

McCarthy loves tackling HMMMMMM.......Donuts.....both on the field and off. time to take his donuts and hit the road.

Time for a new regime from the top down.

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Qoojo's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:27 am

1. Capers gone.
2. They need to figure out why Jones did not get more carries in the last game. I suspect it's because Rodgers changed the play, and some of the needs to be curtailed whether Rodgers likes it or not.
3. Must get more experienced back up talent and limit so much of the roster devoted to UDFA. Packers have 8, maybe 9 now that they signed the one guy off Denver's PS, of the 53 roster spots devoted to UDFA.

Approximately 5 years till Rodgers is done and the packers join the QB carousel like most of the other teams. History repeats itself. After White, Wolf, and Holmgren left, Favre never got much help from the defensive side. No need to mention about the only year Rodgers played with a respectable defense.

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Razer's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:41 am

Well said Qoojo. I know your 2 point about Aaron Jones is more game specific but it is totally on point when it comes to this offense.

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Qoojo's picture

December 21, 2017 at 03:12 pm

Yep, point two was about figuring out how the run game could end up so completely abandoned in a game where the QB needed protection. I suspect it was Rodgers. If so, he needs to be constrained in a bit on that. Then how is Jones not utilized more after 3 carries for 47 yards I think. I know run attempts will go way up for the rest of the season :)

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HankScorpio's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:12 pm

"Must get more experienced back up talent and limit so much of the roster devoted to UDFA. Packers have 8, maybe 9 now that they signed the one guy off Denver's PS, of the 53 roster spots devoted to UDFA."

The are no roster spots devoted to UDFA. There are 53 roster spots devoted to players. Some of those players were not drafted in their rookie year. It's an utterly meaningless distinction that some of those players were not drafted. And it would have been a shame had arbitrary thinking on UDFA had cost the Packers guys like Tramon Williams and Cullen Jenkins over the years

Further, "experienced" backups are also "more expensive" backups if for no other reason than the minimum salary scale in the CBA. With the salary cap, you can average about $3 mil/player. So Rodgers' $20 mil means about 5 guys on rookie deals to average it out. Nelson & Cobb would be another 5 more. Matthews, Perry, Burnett, Bakh, Bulaga...well, you get the picture. To paraphrase Nathan Jessup, you want those rookie deals on the roster, you NEED those rookie deals on the roster

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Qoojo's picture

December 21, 2017 at 03:06 pm

Kind of got into this in another post, but when there are that many players devoted to a basic farm system, some of them will eventually have to play. If they are not good enough, then performance today suffers for potential tomorrow. I know that they need to take risks on some players, but I think 8 or 9 UDFA is going too cheap and devoting too much of the roster to it. I think the current defensive performance supports this as late in the season as the UDFA players get significant play time. Half those spots should be drafted players, or competent experience FA backups. I think that many UDFA players points to problem in draft evaluation too.

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HankScorpio's picture

December 21, 2017 at 07:20 pm

No doubt that the bottom end of the roster will be called upon to play. It's on the personnel dept and coaching staff to make sure they are ready when called upon. In some cases they have and others they have not. The OL fared reasonably through injury. The CBs not so much. Of course that could be about the coaching of those two units, too (as has been much discussed)

I just don't get caught up much in the road that brought them to GB. For example, take the case of Montravious Adams & Quinton Dial making the team and Brian Price being one of the last cut. For 2017, would it have made any difference if they had kept the UDFA Price over the drafted rookie or the vet FA they kept? I guess you could add another vet FA name to that mix in Ricky-Jean Francios, None of them gave much of anything. Price could have given not much of anything just as easily.

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flackcatcher's picture

December 22, 2017 at 01:14 am

And the draft is pretty much a crap shoot. TT drafting and the front office scouting have kept this team in the playoff hunt till this year. I agree with you Hank on FA, but pro football FA has become such guessing game, I can understand why TT has been so careful when he enters it.

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Razer's picture

December 21, 2017 at 09:36 am

I haven't been one to call for MM head because we are winning just enough. But I ask you "who is in charge of the players and coaches?". Mike McCarthy has accepted this level of performance from his coaching staff for these last years and done nothing other than witness 10 men on the field errors and missed assignments. I was glad when he gave up playcalling so that he could focus on the the big picture. How did that go?!

We win because we have just enough talent and Aaron Rodgers. Beyond that the players don't seem to know how to stop a screen play or what a TE does. What does it say when nobody from McCarthy's coaching tree has succeeded in this league. I know it is frustration but it is time to either be a head coach or get out.

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cuervo's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:03 am

"But I ask you "who is in charge of the players and coaches?". Mike McCarthy has accepted this level of performance from his coaching staff for these last years and done nothing other than witness 10 men on the field errors and missed assignments."

I have been attempting to get others to realize this, but to no avail. They blame DC and TT, but as you point out, TT and Mark Murphy don't hire the coaches or have anything to do with them...that's ALL ON MM.

Part of being a good boss, owner, manager, is hiring and keeping people that are good at their jobs. Allowing substandard performance to continue for years on end is a basis for the BIg Guy to get canned. It was years with Sean Slocum and now DC, Winston Moss, etc.

I mentioned earlier, I think there's abut a 2% chance MM gets fired, but if he doesn't make drastic changes to the coaching staff it will prove he is and has been the primary problem since 2011.

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Qoojo's picture

December 21, 2017 at 03:00 pm

I just don't know how capers kept his job all these years. I suspect that MM sympathizes with Capers, and thinks he isn't getting the players to run his defense. I imagine that capers sounds like a genius in the meetings after the game, and he clearly demonstrates to MM how player x and y were out of position and did not follow his scheme. Probably repeatedly blames youth and poor talent, or it is implied. This is about the only scenario I can guess at for Capers to have kept his job this long.

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Finwiz's picture

December 21, 2017 at 03:58 pm

That's the theory expressed by Nagler, and it also implies a bit of a riff between MM and TT. What's odd is, nobody does anything to change it, even though clearly some people are not on the same page up there. MM protects Capers, and TT doesn't want to lose MM, and Murphy probably doesn't want to upset the continuity and dump TT. Endless cycle and relative insanity.

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Ds300916's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:13 am

We have to extend McCarthy this offseason if anyone wants change at defensive coordinator. No defensive coordinator in their right mind will come work for a "lame duck" head coach.

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rdent's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:17 am

We have seen and heard the rumblings about change for years but nothing as loud as it has become this year. We as fans have watched this team the last 6 years, especially the Defense,flounder during the season and the Playoffs year in and year out, yet we continue to see the same old same regime squander a HOF QB's best years with 1 SB Trophy to show for it. As great as Aaron Rodgers is it has now become obvious that even he cannot carry this average roster to another Championship. Time for wholesale change.

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daveh's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:24 am

I will iterate what I have said at the end season for past three years..MM and TT will never get this team back to the Super Bowl. I think now is time to clean house, this team is so vanilla that it scares no one..same thing year in and year out. One thing I can guarantee you Packers wont be mentioned in preseason to go to the Super Bowl...thank god for that. MERRY EX0MAS eveyone

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TarynsEyes's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:36 am

Why would McCarthy fire Capers before getting his extension? MM's extension may be based on firing Capers which will force his hand with Capers. If no extension for MM then Capers will walk with him hand in hand after next season.

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HankScorpio's picture

December 21, 2017 at 02:04 pm

If McCarthy is thinking anything close to that, he should be fired now to get it over with.

And I generally like McCarthy as HC. I think he's done way more good than bad. But Capers continued employment has been a growing part of the bad for too long. If he doesn't cut that out now, it will consume him in the process.

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NWPackersfan's picture

December 21, 2017 at 10:40 am

Do I have to say anymore....Here tis the perfect example of number one Defenses vs Number One Offenses and the super bowl results. Check it out and Capers has to go!!!!
https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/gallery/super-bowl-51-new-england-patriots...

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NickPerry's picture

December 22, 2017 at 05:49 am

Thompson.... I think Thompson should go. His drafts have been mostly weak the last several years, really more so since losing Schneider, Dorsey, and McKinzie. He's failed to address to many positions of need no matter how glaring years at a time and is reluctant to say the least to add an impact FA.

McCarthy... It seems everybody thinks McCarthy should stay, even if Thompson is let go. I highly doubt McCarthy would keep his job if a new GM was to be named. Most GM's would want to hire their own HC, not keep the one that was there. If one of the 3 HAD to stay, McCarthy would be my choice.

Capers... FIRE HIS ASS!!! No more needs to be said about Capers. I think they should fire him now so the Packers have the first shots at a DC who they might want from another staff who's fired. No matter what Capers has to go!

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 21, 2017 at 11:15 am

'Thompson.... I think Thompson should go. His drafts have been mostly weak the last several years, really more so since losing Schneider, Dorsey, and McKinzie. He's failed to address to many positions of need no matter how glaring years at a time and is reluctant to say the least to add an impact FA.'

While I agree with you, I have to admit, he did hit on players the last couple of years.
2016- Kenny Clark is a beast. Martinez is a stud. Lowry is a starter. Davis is their PR. They should at least have a couple of good backups in Spriggs/Murphy. That was a good overall draft.

2017 - way to early to say how good/bad this draft was. But the early signs of King, Josh Jones, Williams and Aaron Jones are very, very good.
We have yet to really see Adams and Biegel. And who knows if Yancey/Mays/Amichia have a future with the team or not.

These last couple of drafts were good.

Problem was the previous drafts.

My ultimate hope is that if Thompson stays he stays for this draft only and gives the GM role to Wolf or whomever.

I think McCarthy stays. I don't think they will promote a GM from within and I think they will at the very least give McCarthy a year.

Capers I think will be gone.

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stockholder's picture

December 21, 2017 at 12:29 pm

RC I almost agree with you. I wanted TT to retire 2 years ago. And then he gets off his duff, and does something great. He did have better drafts these last two years. He did sign FA's. I don't think TT Can't be replaced. I look at why he came him from Seattle. And how Seattle turned things around. I look at some of TT moves before the season starts. Just Head scratchers! But it's about Team needs. Can TT fill them? Can MM fire Capers. MMs biggest downfall is not showing enough Guts when it comes to his own personal. My thinking is if these Guys don't have the Balls to Fire anyone anymore. (Then management should be fired. ) Their judgement is clouded, and they will not do whats best for the team, or their Fans. MM must Fire Capers now. And if any staff member shows more loyalty to Capers then him. Fire them. This must be done before the draft.

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:26 pm

I don't think Thompson will retire until after the draft at the earliest. Might not until next year.

We can look at the moves he made prior to the season, but most people thought it was an upgrade getting Bennett over Cook. And then thought House was a good signing as well as Francois and Evans.
Now these moves all didn't work out, but its easy to look in hindsight at it.

I agree, They have to get rid of Capers.

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OrganLeroy's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:55 pm

Thompson's not retiring, everyone needs to get off that wagon. His contract expires the day after the 2019 Draft and there's every reason to believe that if he wants to continue, Murphy will give him a new contract. Get used to it!

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NickPerry's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:20 pm

RC...Murphy and Spriggs are a couple of SLUGS. I'm sorry buddy but I can no longer look at Thompson with the glass half full. Christ it isn't even half empty when looking at his body of work the last 4 or 5 years. It's closer to a 1/8th!

Clark hopefully continues to progress but "A Beast" he's not, not yet but I do like him a lot. Martinez made a nice jump but still is pretty weak in coverage. He's SUPPOSED to have a lot of tackles in that position so at least he does what he's supposed to do and Lowry is pretty much a JAG though who knows.

Hey I'm GLAD your totally jazzed about several players on the roster. Guys like you help keep me from diving off the cliff!!! I'm sure as the season is further and further away and we get closer to 2018 I'll sport the Green and Gold Glasses like I usually do. After all, I was the guy who said Frackrell would have 8 sacks this past season. Hows THAT for optimism!!

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:43 pm

Spriggs is better now then he was this summer. While he may never be a good starter, I think he will be at least a capable backup. Not exactly what you want as a 2nd round pick. But not a complete waste either. And maybe he can develop more. Like I said he has improved since training camp.

Murphy - I am interested in seeing what happens with him. Some thought he was going to be a OG. Perhaps he will get moved there.

I strongly disagree about Clark not being a Beast. Just watch him in the trenches. He continually takes on double teams, throws guys aside, and gets in the backfield. He doesn't have the stats, but thats not his job. He is starting to get more sacks and stuff these last however many weeks too.

I disagree about Martinez, too. He is pretty decent in coverage for an ILB. Not many ILB's are great in coverage and I don't think he is as bad as most. I think its more of a matchups with him. There are certain matchups he simply isn't good enough to line up with.

I will always be optimistic. But I seriously think they have some core pieces in place to make the team better. Clark, Daniels, Martinez are really good starts.

I honestly thought Fackrell was going to have a bigger year too. Maybe next year will be the year? He at least has picked up his game some the last half of the season.

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OrganLeroy's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:59 pm

Spriggs is just finishing his 2nd year in the league and only was an offensive lineman a short time in college, he used to be a TE. It's amazing to me how quickly fans write off players in their 1st 2-3 years in the league, that happened to Doug Baldwin then he was traded to Seattle, and how'd that workout?

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 22, 2017 at 09:44 am

There is a reason why they call it draft and develop. They drafted him, now he needs more developing.
Some players require more developing then others.

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Finwiz's picture

December 21, 2017 at 02:08 pm

Sorry RC, but Clark isn't a beast. A beast is in the QB's face or at least 6-8 sacks, even at nose tackle. Is he a potential beast, maybe. Is he a very good player, yeah, he eats up blockers, but he doesn't over power people and get to the QB with big push up the middle.

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NickPerry's picture

December 21, 2017 at 03:59 pm

I have to ask...IF the Packers have THAT many good players then why is the defense always so bad. Yes a majority of it falls on Capers but when you read all the opinions of my fellow fans here including yours, they SHOULD be able to do a hell of a lot better just with all this talent their "Supposed" to have. Talent will shine through no matter what and it's been pretty damn cloudy on the defensive side of the ball in GB.

Just saying...

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 22, 2017 at 09:09 am

It takes a lot more then 3 very good players to make a good defense.

One of the biggest problems with this defense has been the miscommunication's. They simply are never on the same page. From coaches to players, from players to players. There is always issues where people don't know what they are doing. Just look at the Panthers game. The Olson TD. There was a miscommunication that left Olson wide open.

To me about 75% is on the coaches. The miscommunication's are 90% on the coaches. Now can they help it if a player makes a mental error? Not always, but they need to do everything to make sure all the players know what they are doing. We have seen this stuff happening for the last 5+ years. That's to long.

Also, I really think Capers has become to predictable. When he first came to GB, he brought his zone blitzing scheme. Now all we see is zone scheme. We don't see the exotic blitzes anymore. When is the last time we have seen a CB blitz? When is the last time we saw Josh Jones blitz?

Speaking of Jones. He was practicing/playing the ILB/S hybrid position all throughout the offseason and early in the year. He was going to be used in a special way. Then basically since Brice got hurt he has played nothing but safety. I have seen people asking what happened to him. Well, some of it is that he is playing a position he didn't really practice for.

People constantly ask why Clinton-Dix has had a down season. Perhaps a lot of it is how he is used. We have seen him dropping 35+ yards deep down after down. And with various comments that he has made it sounds as if he is completely disinterested in how he is being used. I'm not making excuses for him, but if he doesn't like how he is being used that could affect his play.

I think the players have been tuning out the defensive coaches. Whether its just Capers, or others I have no idea. But it starts with Capers.

Yesterday McCarthy made comments in his press conference that really makes it sound like changes are coming.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 22, 2017 at 09:40 am

I think there is some hyperbole in RC's comment. He's not wrong that TT's last few drafts have been better, imo.

Clark is very good. Not a beast. Yet.

Martinez isn't a stud. (time to be civil.) 2 ticks > average.

Lowry isn't a starter. He is the rotational guy firmly 3rd behind Clark and Daniels in the 2-4-5 scheme we use 75% or more of the time. And he has been < average. He "starts" because Dial, RJF, Adams are even worse.

"The last couple of drafts have been good." Then you write that it is too early to tell about 2017, and don't mention 2015 or any other draft. So what evidence you present only supports that TT had what looks to be one good draft recently: 2016. Arguments can be made for 2011-2015. Some produced the proverbial 3 starters, but he didn't crush any of those drafts.

I'd write more, but Bubba the cat is helping me, so I keep having to correct typos. [Yeah, I realize some of you are cheering Bubba on!]

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RCPackerFan's picture

December 22, 2017 at 10:11 am

TGR -

I do believe Clark is a beast. Follow Ben Fennel on twitter and he will show you why...

Martinez may not be in other people's eyes, but mine he is. He is all over the place and has made so many great tackles that to me he is.

Lowry i think is a starter. In a base 3/4 he is a starter. He is a good 5 technique DE (what he was drafted for). When he plays the 5 Tech. he is really good. Problem is he doesn't play it enough.

The reason why I said the last couple of drafts has been good is because the last 2 have been good. The previous ones, not as much... That what my whole point was. That the last couple of drafts have been good.

I also said that 2017 is to early to tell how good it is because you can't judge a draft class based on one years worth of work. Also the fact that 3 of the 3 top 4 players were injured essentially makes it an incomplete. But the early signs look promising.

Lets be honest 2014 was a really good draft overall. Clinton-Dix was a Pro Bowl player last year and has played well until this year. Adams is in the talk about being a pro bowl player. Richard Rodgers has been a solid complimentary TE. Corey Linsley is their starting OC. Jeff Janis has been a special teams ace.
2015 - Randall is a good pick. Rollins? Montgomery? Ryan a good 2 down ILB, not great. Hundley? Ripkowski a good pick. Montgomery is a good player but has been injured. Rollins had a great rookie year and has been injured the last 2 years. Ripkowski was a great pick. Hundley, they could do worse then him, but he hasn't lit it up like we hoped he would.
2013 - Bakhtiari - Stud. Lacy, Hyde, Tretter were good picks and played well in GB, but are all gone.
2012 - Perry, Hayward, Daniels. If they kept Hayward this would have looked a lot better especially with the way he has played for the Chargers.
2011 - Cobb the only really good pick.

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Finwiz's picture

December 21, 2017 at 02:03 pm

One of my favorite posters I incorrectly left off last weeks list with Bearmeat, Dobber, RC and Since '61.....

You got the edge now, and you got it right.
Don't lose it, we need everyone on board.

Up until a few days ago I was willing to give Thompson a pass, but after I heard Aaron Naglers theory on the defensive problems, I'm no longer a believer in him. Either he's not giving Capers the players he needs to fit his defense, Capers is incompetent or both. Capers has been successful in the past, but if it's a known fact the guy isn't getting the types of players he needs for his scheme they should have replaced him or changed the drafting philosophy. Either way, Thompson shares a major part of the blame in all of this, but bottom line a new voice needs to call the defensive shots, so that begins with Capers.

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NickPerry's picture

December 22, 2017 at 04:50 am

Offense has been on a steady decline since losing Jennings, Jones, and Finley too. No longer can the Packers line up MORE quality WR than the opposing defense has CB.

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HankScorpio's picture

December 22, 2017 at 06:26 am

They were pretty dynamic with Cook last year but for the most part, I agree. With Adams approaching FA and Nelson getting up there in age, the Packers have some questions to answer this offseason.

They can start by taking a good look at Geronimo Allison and spotting in Michael Clark a little in the next two weeks. Maybe try to see if Lance Kendricks can by a dynamic pass catcher.

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Pauly's picture

December 21, 2017 at 11:54 am

"McCarthy has no authority over how Thompson builds the roster."
From today's Ryan Wood column.

I think there should be a major change in that philosophy. McCarthy should have a strong say in what kind of players he needs for his team since he knows how his players mesh and fit his scheme so well and where the weaknesses are. TT is too far removed from the daily grind.
Belichick has been successful with that authority proving it can work. Making surprising and quick trades when necessary.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 22, 2017 at 09:43 am

MM having no authority over how Thompson builds the roster does not mean he has no say or role in its construction.

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Turophile's picture

December 22, 2017 at 11:11 am

exactly TGR. MM has conversations all the time with TT (and I do mean loads of conversations), so Ted knows exactly the kind of player MM wants. They have both affirmed this is how it works.

While Belichek has been very successful in most elements of being both HC and GM, his drafting is pretty spotty. It surely isn't his strongest suit.

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Turophile's picture

December 21, 2017 at 12:06 pm

Ted Thompson. Play out the contract. If he wants to keep on scouting after that, find a place, but not as GM. I like the idea of Russ Ball taking over as GM, with (hopefully) some input still from Ted after the takeover. That probably means the loss of at least one of Gutekunst and Wolf as they seek GM roles elsewhere, but it is what it is.

McCarthy's job i leave to the new GM to decide, but he must at a minimum replace his DC, Capers. I would also like to see at least one other change in the defensive positional coach, because I've seen too much under-performance for too long, and the group needs a shakeup. That should happen naturally with the addition of a new DC - they should bring in at least one guy they like working with.

I want the same done with the training staff, at least one change. The Packers have been one of the worst teams for injury too many times - so it is time for at least some degree of shakeup.

The final result is a fair bit of change, designed to shake up what in my mind is an organisation that has accepted a lower level of achievement than the NFL demands. Aaron Rodgers ability has masked many things that have seen the light when he is out.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

December 21, 2017 at 12:11 pm

Oh all the Wasted Years , all the Wasted Years all because we kept Dom Capers since 2011. Oh how things would have been so much different if we just would let him go. All the years have past now and all those wasted years. You can never get back time.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

December 21, 2017 at 12:14 pm

And the Packer fans own the team? There needs to be a way to make quicker decisions with your Board of Commissioners Etc what sounds like a good idea can be awful when you have too many people trying to make a decision where an individual owner just has to say yay, nay or go. Packer fans just keep wasting the years away.

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Slim11's picture

December 21, 2017 at 12:20 pm

Two of the three have to go.

Murphy isn't going to fire himself. Thompson is getting too comfortable and appears to resist any change. McCarthy is know for fierce (IMO, insane!) loyalty to his assistant coaches.

MM's loyalty to his coaches is why we've had the likes of Shawn Slocum, Tom Clements and , now, Dom Capers for as long as we have. I see no reason to keep Capers around. His presence has been a hindrance to the Packers. Young players are developed then go elsewhere (Hyde and Hayward).

With respect to Winston Moss and Edgar Bennett, who knows? IMO, Bennett hasn't had a true opportunity to be the OC. He was the "OC" when Tom Clements, Associate HC-offense, lost the play calling duties back to McCarthy. During his time in GB, Moss has interviewed twice for HC vacancies but not hired. Does GB really give him a chance as a DC?

It make take the BOD forcing Murphy to act before something happens.

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Tundraboy's picture

December 21, 2017 at 12:23 pm

Lots of needs now on O, but no Packer team has won without a great defense, or at least a very good one.

MM, TT and Capers are fools to believe otherwise. In my lifetime I never thought after Lombardi,especially, that this team would ever be so far removed from its heritage. Green Bay Packers was synonymous with Defense, and Running the Ball. I can somewhat accept the latter, being diminished, as the game is now so pass dominant, but never the former.

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stockholder's picture

December 21, 2017 at 12:37 pm

TT drafted lots of offense last year. (And considering the TEs signed.) The defense is missing the ingredients for a great defense. Some refuse to believe were in a Rebuild. What do you want changed for a good defense ,besides Capers gone?

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Tundraboy's picture

December 22, 2017 at 12:55 am

A pass rusher for starters.

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Mojo's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:22 pm

More cowbell.

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Since&#039;61's picture

December 21, 2017 at 01:35 pm

Biggest changes that need to made are; 1. Fire Capers and 2 spend the cap money and bring in some FAs who can help the team now. We need an experienced pass rusher and an experienced CB. Better depth on the OL and DL would help as well. Jahri Evans did a good job this season. Him or another OL like him would be great backups for our often battered and injured OL.

The approach to building the team must change which probably means that TT needs to go. This team needs to recognize that we need better players on defense, especially at OLB, CB and maybe safety depending on the status of Burnett (FA) and Dix (still in a fog). We are weak at 3 levels of the defense and we could use better depth for the DL rotation.

Time for a fresh approach on building the roster and on defense. Chuck Capers and if TT stays let him pick OLs and WRs and have someone else draft the defense and a TE. Time is running out. There is no guarantee that Rodgers signs with the Packers when his contract runs out. Maybe the plan is for Rodgers, MM, TT and DC to all leave together. Who knows? Stranger things have happened. Thanks, Since '61

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HankScorpio's picture

December 21, 2017 at 02:08 pm

Here is a tweet from Casey Hayward:

"Super happy for my brother @micah_hyde I'm proud of you bro. I guess we will be teammates once again lol. I'm glad you get to show your true skills with the Bills. love you bro."

The obvious implication is that he did not get to show his true skills with the Packers. That's on Capers. Making that change alone will give the rest of the offseason moves a much better chance to succeed. Without that change, I am pessimistic that anything else will fundamentally alter the outlook.

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Christopher Gennaro's picture

December 21, 2017 at 05:15 pm

ugh that quote made me throw up a little, maybe someone in the front office sees that. Oh wait it wouldn't matter anyways, still stings thou.

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pacman's picture

December 21, 2017 at 03:03 pm

They really all have to go. They seem to be so tied to each other. The problem is that this seems to go all the way to the top - otherwise they should have fixed something years ago.

The only hope is that this year, it became too obvious to ignore any longer. Looking much more forward to the end of the season now more than ever.

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Hematite's picture

December 22, 2017 at 05:56 am

I have been beating the drum to fire Thompson and Capers for the last 4 or 5 years and given McCarthy the benefit of the doubt.
I have changed my mind.
Give all three the boot when the final seconds tick off in Detroit..
I definitely don't want Thompson around the Packers in any capacity.
I'd like to see a clean sweep!

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croatpackfan's picture

December 22, 2017 at 06:02 am

OK. You know better than me the situation in NFL (not to mention college football).

Tell me, who in the place of TT, who in the place of MM and who in the place of DC...

And do not comes to me with craps like Bill Belichik or Mike Zimmer...

Thanks for your input...

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UmpireMark's picture

December 22, 2017 at 09:23 am

Absent of specific names, here is what I would do. I understand this is merely my opinion ...

For GM, it's time to give Elliot Wolf his due. Let him build a staff and a team.

Head Coach, I would try to tap into successful organizations/staffs that have shown innovation and adaptability to the ever changing league. I would seek a "Paul Chryst" type demeanor that gets the most out of players and believe in the program.

For Def. Coord. which the HC probably will hire, I'd look for a disciple of the 3-4 teams that excell at running a stout defense from that 3-4 base D. Like Pitt or Jax.

Not having specific names is a cop out to answering your posted question, but other than Wolf, I would look for the above personalities. My opinion, only ... ...

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UmpireMark's picture

December 22, 2017 at 07:31 am

A thought ... there is not a coach or assistant on this team any other NFL team is looking to purge. We cannot even develop talent on the coaching staff.

Look at the coaches and assistants Paul Chryst has lost in his short tenure and how well he has replaced them.

Ask yourself this, if the Packers fired MM, DC and TT in one fell swoop, what NFL team would dive in and snap them boys up? Not even Cleveland!

Time for major change, I say.

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croatpackfan's picture

December 22, 2017 at 02:53 pm

Tank you for z
your time and answer...

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