The Packers' Power Structure is about to be Tested this Offseason
The fate of the franchise will hang in the balance.
By JosephR
The Packers' unique authoritative structure is in for a major test this offseason.
Despite fans nationwide bemoaning the sustained enabling of one Joe Barry, and the statistics showing that the defense continues to regress, Head Coach Matt LaFleur has continued to stay the course with his first hire for Defensive Coordinator. We've heard his usual excuses of needing to "look at the tape" and asserting that the defensive failures are "on him", but has yet to show any real improvement. While there is some hope a change could be made this offseason, LaFleur has shown no sign of possibly making a change at any point between now and the 2024 season.
Unfortunately, LaFleur has no stimuli to get him to act. If the Carolina Panthers, the league's worst offense scoring 30 on the defense, nearly coming away with an upset victory won't convince him, it's safe to say nothing ever will. The one thing that might've been able to push him was negated way back in 2018. Packers' CEO/President Mark Murphy created a flattened structure where General Manager Brian Gutekunst, VP of Football Operations Russ Ball, and LaFleur all reported directly to him; essentially making them all equals.
This restructure is a stark departure from the typical structure that the rest of the league follows, where the General Manager controls personnel moves, including the hiring of the head coach. In this structure, the GM would be able to fire the head coach due to performance. While I'm in no way suggesting LaFleur be fired, he is essentially tying his job security to Barry. I would say that LaFleur's job security is excellent currently, but should the Packers' winning ways not return in 2024, it wouldn't be unrealistic to say his seat would get warm in 2025 if the defense was routinely seen as the scapegoat for losses piling up.
I would hate to see LaFleur go under any circumstances, but this would be a hard pill to swallow seeing as he could have saved himself by just making a change at Defensive Coordinator. The 2024 coaching cycle is full of prime candidates who could take over the defense, with resumes that Joe Barry could only dream of having.
I do not doubt in my mind that under a more traditional structure, Gutekunst would push LaFleur to jettison Barry. After all, he can't do his job as GM properly without adequate coaching. Gutekunst will likely turnover several key positions on the roster, but he has to have a proper evaluation. How do you evaluate a player when their potential is being wasted? Take for example, Darnell Savage. Savage looked like a potential All-Pro in only his 2nd year in the league, but now he's a shell of his former self. We've already seen former players such as Krys Barnes and Oren Burks resurrect their careers elsewhere in the league, with coordinators who far exceed Barry's skill level. It's be amazing to see what a better candidate at the helm could do with eight (possibly nine?) 1st Round Picks on the roster.
In addition, Gutekunst also has to work Free Agency. While money certainly does talk, if the Packers are tangled with another club for a player, you better believe Barry will be a factor. I've always said "wins equal winnings", and a player on a short-term contract looking to cash in needs not only a solid body of work plus team performance to secure a major payday. The NFC North rivals the Bears and Vikings have shown a tendency to overpay for former Packers, and it's not an uncommon trend elsewhere in the league as well. While elite players will always command large salaries, a very good player could leverage his team's performance for an even better contract than what their current market value might be. Does Joe Barry help with that push? I'd resoundingly say, "Absolutely not."
The future of the franchise, or at least its defense rests in Murphy's hands. Murphy was influential in the firing of Mike McCarthy on the back end of the season, but a defensive coordinator may seem like an overreach since that authority is typically reserved for the head coach. But given this restructure of the deck, who's to say Murphy can't order LaFleur to cut him loose? So long as the Packers remain in the playoff hunt, I expect Murphy to stay his hand. But should the last two games of the season go awry, I expect....at least I hope for Murphy to step in on the matter. It's well known Murphy is hitting his mandated retirement age in the offseason of 2025, so he's got essentially one more season to get the franchise headed in the right direction.
We've said repeatedly, "In Gute We Trust." Do we have the same faith in Mark? Time will tell.
#GPG
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__________________________
Joseph has been an avid fan of the Green Bay Packers since 1997, citing an affinity for dairy products during his childhood and his favorite color, green. Born in Jacksonville, FL, Joseph currently is an Active Duty servicemember in the U.S. Armed Forces. Joseph considers himself a lifelong fan of the game of football, competing since his youth well into adulthood. When it comes to the Pack, Joseph is particularly impassioned about the NFL Draft and collegiate scouting process, and will contribute regularly on CHTV.com leading to that year's upcoming Draft. You can follow him on Twitter at @joeyreyallday.
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Comments (46)
Guam
December 31, 2023 at 11:49 am
Bullseye JosephR!!!
If Lafleur won't act at the end of the season, Murphy must. It is becoming increasingly clear that Barry is losing the defensive locker room. Between the departure of Gray last year, Campbell's tweet and Jaire claiming the defense "had his back" when he went out for the coin toss in Charlotte as well as the general grumbling about the structure of the defense, it is clear Barry is a lost cause.
If Lafleur can't see this, Murphy must and help his head coach make the right decision. The fans are holding their collective breath.......
Since'75
December 31, 2023 at 12:23 pm
Who is the Boss?
Coldworld
December 31, 2023 at 03:30 pm
If LaFleur can’t see this then he has to go? That he couldn’t see it last season was a warning, that he couldn’t see against Baltimore and even two weeks ago, then last week …. LaFleur is the problem. He’s the head coach. They are his people, his decisions. Getting rid of Barry doesn’t solve that problem, as necessary as it is.
Tackle the core issue if you want change. If the team leaves LaFleur in place, don’t expect real change because they don’t seek it. Murphy chose LaFleur, he presided over his decisions. We will see what he’s made of in how this is handled.
MooPack
December 31, 2023 at 03:45 pm
Simplicity lost on many. I agree with you. Unfortunately, I can't see a change until Murphy is gone. Even with a new DC and some improvement overall next year, LaFleur is not a coach that will overcome better coached teams come playoff time.
Tundraboy
December 31, 2023 at 04:54 pm
"LaFleur is not a coach that will overcome better coached teams come playoff time."
Isn't that the first ability required of a HC? And the ultimate difference maker between a Super Bowl Champion and a also ran. It's exactly what has held us back many times in the past.
I just don't understand why that is so hard to see and understand with our current group. For it to occur in Green Bay is just mind numbing. Pursuit of excellence.
barutanseijin
December 31, 2023 at 05:02 pm
I could see Lafleur’s firing as a problem for you. What will CW complain about when all is rainbows and unicorns and superbowl rings?
Coldworld
December 31, 2023 at 05:57 pm
He will be happy. And long before that if competence returns.
Guam
January 01, 2024 at 04:11 pm
I have been on the "fire MLF" bandwagon for some time, but I assume MLF will be safe until Murphy retires. I am settling for terminating Barry and getting a legitimate DC as the best that will happen until 2025.
Bitternotsour
December 31, 2023 at 03:38 pm
Murphy's successor needs to be hired this offseason. They can restructure as a part of that hire.
Tundraboy
December 31, 2023 at 06:16 pm
That would be far too intelligent an idea !
Spock
December 31, 2023 at 12:00 pm
"The fate of the franchise will hang in the balance." is a bit of hyperbole to me, but I think most fans of GB want to go back to the structure Bob Harlen worked so hard to get. I'm old enough to remember the Judge Parins board of directors and coach Bart Starr having to defend his GAME PLAN each week to them. That was when the franchise was truly hanging in the balance Ron Wolf being brought in by Harlan and going to the more "standardized" league structure truly IMHO saved the franchise from itself. Murphy's messing with that may (may) be working for him, but we need to go back to the former structure. I'd like to see one of Murphy's final acts to be to reinstate the previous structure before he retires. Doubt he'd do it, but it would certainly give his "legacy" a high note to end on!
Houndog
December 31, 2023 at 01:08 pm
Spock.
Do you also remember that Parins at one time offered the GM position to Ron Wolf? Unfortunately, it was a position similar to what you describe with the Executive committee involved and Wolf turned them down. The position was then given to Tom Braatz.
Since'75
December 31, 2023 at 01:57 pm
The biggest thing i remember about Judge Robert Parins is after he retired, he admitted he didn't know anything about running a football franchise.
His past experience consisted of him being a Circuit Court Judge.
***********
Not unlike when the BOD's HAD to instruct Murphy to remove Thompson.
The BOD's also HAD to tell Parins to fire Bart Starr.
This franchise was broken until (to his credit) Parins hired Bob Harlan, who along with Ron Wolf set out to fix the franchise, which they did,
Now were back to where the Packers were when......
Well, you get the picture.
Broken
Houndog
December 31, 2023 at 04:58 pm
Since'75.
I think it's broken more than many want to admit, but I'm a construction manager. I've spent my entire life looking ahead at the bigger and whole picture. On larger projects we build schedules looking 2- 3 years in advance. On one of my projects we did out-looks of 5 years ahead, and you have allow for the 'What-If's" and unknowns. Like the John Jones era.
So OK, Murphy has 1-1/2 years left, and it could be said that LaFleur's future could be cloudy. Is LaFleur safe if 2024 goes South, I think not?
Many of us on this site feel that not just Barry, but more assistants should be replaced, but that won't be easy. Even if it's just Barry.
Assistant coaches want some security, they don't want to move their families year after year.
With Murphy's pending retirement, many new 'Bosses' like assembling their own teams, whether that be players or management positions. In a successful situation they'll be more apt to stay with the existing at least for a while. Or, they could clean house.
Is LaFluer successful enough? Is their enough security in GB for a young 'rising star' coach to consider it at a time like this? Or even Mike Zimmer, a great "D" coach wanting to come out of retirement for maybe a couple more years. Does he want to move again next year, or two years from now?
Let's hope I'm Wrong!
Since'75
December 31, 2023 at 06:16 pm
Thanks for the well thought out response Hound, it's always nice to deal with intelligence.
***********
My response is utterly simple.
If 2024 goes south, everyone is going south.
Again, with one caveat, as i've mentioned.
Unless Murphy promotes from within for his seat, and doesn't change the power structure back to pre 2018 then maybe the boys club stays together.
Barry will still be the fall guy.
Happy Near Year Hound and the rest of you fine people!!.🍻🎈😁
Tundraboy
December 31, 2023 at 05:01 pm
I guess it's all because of our unique ownership, noone ever really knows how to handle this unique arrangement. Over the decades, it seems that we lose sight of and forget how lucky we are and always need some strong willed person to come in and shake us and remind us what we have here. How special this place is. Lombardi, Vanaesi, Wolf, Holmgren.
Houndog
December 31, 2023 at 05:27 pm
Tundra,
Bob Harlan knew, he had it right, did it right, and he hired the right guy.
That all changed when Murphy tore down that structure in 2018.
Tundraboy
December 31, 2023 at 06:20 pm
Yes, he did ,sorry I forgot to include him.
Since'75
December 31, 2023 at 01:45 pm
I don't see Murphy's 2018 restructure working for him.
The former power structure actually worked for Wolf and Thompson, as they both won Super Bowls.
Proven success.
The only success Murphy's enjoyed since 2018 is when Rodgers was being a MVP.
Murphy could keep the current power structure in place i suppose.
But recent history tells us it's foolish.
But then again, a lot of intelligent Packer fans feel that Murphy shouldn't have anything to do with football operations at all anyway.
TVOR
splitpea1
December 31, 2023 at 01:06 pm
To tell you the truth, I can't wait for the unveiling of the succession plan--hopefully one with a traditional GM at the top.
Trust factors:
MLF: Very little. He's done a good in developing Love and the young receivers. Other than that, which is obviously very important, I'm not finding a whole lot else to brag about here. He's more or less an offensive coordinator who has shown very little growth as a head coach. Leaving the development of our relatively young defense in the hands of Barry for so long is an unpardonable offense in my opinion.
Murphy: A little more, but this is no way a ringing endorsement of the structure he has created. There's a reason it's unique: because you want the GM and head coach to always be on the same page, not on some kind of co-equal arrangement where differing philosophies may be at play, thus affecting the on-field product. Cracks in the system need to be minimized. But being the way things are right now, Murphy almost has to force the DC issue if MLF won't--we can't have any more of this charade.
Gute: Some. Overall he's done a respectable job, especially with the extensive transition on offense. But as noted, it's very difficult to fully evaluate his defensive personnel because they're often not placed in positions to succeed. He's not fully off the hook here, though. Specifically I'm talking about run defense and tackling ability--things that need to be stressed more in selecting the personnel before they ever set foot in Green Bay. I'm not totally against draft-and-develop (as long as it's not too protracted); sometimes it works quite well--IF you have a coaching staff that can make it happen. But I'm all for drafting players that can help you both now and in the future (while taking advantage of the rookie contracts) instead of limited snaps early and hoping the pick(s) turn into a grand slam three years later. That being said, Gary has turned out to be an impactful selection and hopefully we can say the same about Van Ness in a little less time.
White92
December 31, 2023 at 01:24 pm
I agree with a lot of your post. I am much more critical of Gute. The only reason why I would possibly give him a pass is if the Rodgers contract albatross was not his decision as many on here have said. Aside from that, he drafted a long snapper and a punter in his first draft. If he inherited such a poor roster as many have said, what was he doing drafting a punter and a long snapper with a HOF QB on the roster? He has spent a ton of draft capital on the defense which is perennially among the worst in the NFL. He drafted for the future, trading up to have the next QB hold a clipboard for 2 years while disrespecting the diva HOF QB who never got over it. Tee Higgins would have been good teaming with Adams while Rodgers was still in his prime.
.
I still view Gutekunst as the kid that stole his Dad's Porsche and drove it into a tree.
Turophile
December 31, 2023 at 01:10 pm
If a power structure does not allow for putting pressure on the head coach if there is a disconnect in his 'team' and it is failing in some respect, then it is a poor power structure.
If the man in overall charge (Murphy) is unwilling to put pressure on a head coach to change something, when everyone else in the organisation from the players on up can identify the problem, then he needs to empower someone else (Gute) to put the pressure on.
If this isn't happening, players, who have to justify their employment constantly, will see the lack of accountability with their bosses and things go to hell from there.
I don't hate the current structure (though I sure don't love it, either), but there has to be provision within that structure for a strong message to be delivered, if necessary.
The_Baloney_Stops_Here
January 04, 2024 at 08:14 am
Sure it does. Its just that the pressure has to come from Murphy.
White92
December 31, 2023 at 01:11 pm
I'm not sure why the love for MLF other than "the record". Well, the record also includes 2 bad playoff losses at home as a favorite with a HOF QB and several incidences of undisciplined play that has only gotten worse. That is the tip of the iceberg.
The only reason to keep MLF in my opinion would be to keep continuity for Jordan Love. I don't see any other team snapping him up if he were available today.
Houndog
December 31, 2023 at 01:27 pm
White92,
I'm with you, what's the deal? What's he done by himself?
Those first three 13-3 teams had Aaron Rodgers and Davante Adams along with others, and all of his teams have been plagued by lousy defenses and shit ST's.
I'm happy with the "O.s" improvements this season but the D and ST's are still a mess. He's had 5 years to fix them.
SicSemperTyrannis
January 01, 2024 at 12:15 am
MLF as OC might be ok. All his weaknesses fit within the job description of HC.
Since'61
December 31, 2023 at 01:13 pm
it's the same on going question with the Packers FO. Where is the sense of urgency? My concern is that if the Packers reach the playoffs will that become the reasoning/excuse to continue with Barry into 2024? I think that we know where MLF probably stands on that issue. Can or will Murphy force his hand on the DC or will he coast into retirement and leave his successor to deal with it?
When Murphy had the chance to move Rodgers out after the 2021 season he chose to give Rodgers a salary cap crippling contract. "We're not idiots." And yet the Packers are at another crossroad concerning the team's direction for the 2024 offseason. It would be a nice accomplishment for the Packers to reach the playoffs in 2023 but the price might be another season of Barry. In any case we should have our answer in one month's time or less. GPG! Thanks, Since '61
Houndog
December 31, 2023 at 01:17 pm
Josephr,
I'm sorry, but I've never seen or heard of the "In Gute We Trust" movement you speak of, I might have been boiling an egg at the time.
As for whether or not we can trust Murphy to do the right thing, I think we've seen pretty much everything Murphy's capable of. He's basically invisible, but really good at tearing down a successful structure.
ricky
December 31, 2023 at 02:25 pm
All too often, I think that Murphy thinks of the growing "Packer Experience" that is bringing in revenue, and less about the team itself. That he is a builder of parks and venues, but not as interested in building a serious contender for a SB run.
mnbadger
December 31, 2023 at 02:34 pm
Murphy - great job growing the business.
Terrible job allowing former qb's last contract.
Terrible job setting up the current structure of the organization.
Gutey - great job picking talent, though not perfect. Draft and FA for the most part.
Terrible job agreeing to work within the current structure of the organization.
Terrible job for any role in former qb's last contract.
mlf - terrible game manager.
Terrible mentor and leader for the rest of the staff, no fear of accountability.
No stones whatsoever.
No ability to put the team in best position to win play to play, series to series or game to game.
Long term, Murphy is forced to leave, Gutey has earned a chance with the next staff - see below.
mlf needs to go and take jb and a few others with him.
IMHO
Packers 33 - m'ladies 30.
GPG!
SicSemperTyrannis
January 01, 2024 at 12:19 am
Blowing it all up now sets JL10 and the O back too far.
MLF as OC could fix all that, assuming a good HC. Bill Belichick is available.
stockholder
December 31, 2023 at 04:09 pm
Gute is not the Poster Boy.
And " The In Gute we Trust" is a poor motto.
This is nothing but a notorious Boys Club.
Faith has nothing to do with success.
It's too bad you went down that road.
Especially since everyone knew the odds when
the season started.
The_Baloney_Stops_Here
January 04, 2024 at 08:17 am
And yet they're 4 quarters away from playoffs which basically nullifies a season's worth of your silly proclamations.
lou
December 31, 2023 at 04:11 pm
Don't hold your breath that Murphy will propose or support changing the organizational structure back to what Bob Harlan created nor will the Executive Committee/Board of Directors (who love their status symbols). With that in mind if it stays the same I doubt his successor would want it changed either, in effect based on the current power structure no one can say that all but one NFL franchise has an OWNER because Murphy has that power but with out the formal title.
DocHoliday
December 31, 2023 at 04:24 pm
Murphy needs to ride off into the sunset and never look back.
His structure stinks and he suffers from foot in mouth disease.
For those who forget, when Murphy hired MLF, Murphy required Pettine be the DC and Pettine decide defensive coaches.
Murphy had the ability to say yes or no to Barry.
DragonSilk
December 31, 2023 at 04:54 pm
The system Murphy set up is obviously not working. We can't get over the hump. Way too much talent on this team to be wasting it.
On another topic, I'm always going to be rooting for a win and a playoff spot. But if we miss the playoffs and end up on Hard Knocks next year, I have to admit I won't be too bummed about it.
Houndog
December 31, 2023 at 05:50 pm
Dragon,
What the hell does Hard Knocks have to do with anything?
It's a media circus!
jurp
December 31, 2023 at 05:55 pm
Scooter needs to go. He said at the end of last season that he wasn't making any assistant coaching changes due to "consistency". We're looking at being a consistently mediocre team. He's an OC, not an HC.
The_Baloney_Stops_Here
January 04, 2024 at 08:18 am
So he successfully develops the most important position in football and has this young team one win away from playoffs and you want to fire him? And replace him with who exactly?
jurp
January 07, 2024 at 06:15 pm
He didn't develop Love, Clements did.
SinceLombardi
December 31, 2023 at 07:12 pm
Not sure exactly why MLF has so much job security. 2-3 playoff record, two losses as #1 seed. A dismal showing on a win and in to close out the 22 season. Inconsistent offense , horrible assistant picks, and a soft culture.
Too many excuses about youth and injuries.. how would Cleveland, and Indy do with MLF??
Tundraboy
January 01, 2024 at 01:35 pm
Two losses at home as the # 1 seed will always be in my mind. I mean how many years did we wait for a Championship game at home. I waited a good chunk of my life waiting for a return to Glory. Waited til 97. To blow two back to back is something I will not get over.
stockholder
December 31, 2023 at 11:48 pm
Test? After tonights game-
Both can go back down into their Rabbit Hole.
jboss
January 01, 2024 at 04:16 am
Great D tonight!
I trust Murphy, he is a defensive minded guy.
Fubared
January 02, 2024 at 02:54 pm
Hold your horsees people. First they dont want to fire Barry or they have to find someone else who may want money. No they are privately hoping we beat the bears and Barry is a keeper for next year. Ya you get into the playoffs you cant bitch about the D coach.
If they lose to the Bears badly and dont get into the playoffs then Barrys neck is hanging on the line but this management makes very slow moves because it is about money. You dont have deep pocket owners saying wow I'm throwing my money away on this guy when with the packers its your money they are throwing away.
The_Baloney_Stops_Here
January 04, 2024 at 08:14 am
0% chance they give Barry a new contract.