The Packers Should Follow the Seahawks Coaching Staff Model

LaFleur should hire more assistant coaches to his staff

Matt LaFleur has already said the Green Bay Packers plan to keep their coaching staff as it is. Adam Stenavich will probably be the offensive coordinator, and Joe Barry will, despite the general criticism, be the defensive coordinator for the Packers in 2023. And while there is merit in continuity, the lack of new defensive ideas and the offensive brain drain the Packers went through last offseason were costly for Green Bay in 2022.

That's why, even if LaFleur doesn't plan to make significant changes to the staff, it would be important to add new football minds. A good way to do so is to follow what Pete Carroll did to improve the Seattle Seahawks staff.

In addition to the coordinators, Carroll hired two associate head coaches from different backgrounds, one for each side of the ball. On defense, they promoted Clint Hurtt from defensive line coach to defensive coordinator, but also hired former Chicago Bears coordinator Sean Desai to associate head coach/defense. On offense, they kept coordinator Shane Waldron, and added Carl Smith, a veteran coach who had previous experiences coordinating the New Orleans Saints and Jacksonville Jaguars units — he was also the Seahawks quarterbacks coach from 2011 to 2017, one of the main responsible for developing Russell Wilson.

So, even if the Packers want to keep Adam Stenavich and Joe Barry as coordinators, the associate head coach position is still attractive for other assistants.
Below, there is a list of potential options for Green Bay — I tried to be as realistic as possible, because a potential head coach or current coordinator probably wouldn't accept a non-playcalling position.

Offense
Scott Turner, former Washington Commanders offensive coordinator

Norv's son was the Commanders OC for three seasons and had decent results despite the lack of a good quarterback plan by the franchise. He has a different schematic background, which would be perfect for this role.

Thomas Brown, Los Angeles Rams assistant head coach/tight ends coach
Brown is a very respected coach and has been with the Rams since 2020, first as a running backs coach, and moving to the tight ends group this season. He was also promoted to assistant head coach last season. He will interview for the Houston Texans head coaching position, which shows how good of a leader he is considered to be.

Mike LaFleur, former New York Jets offensive coordinator
Matt's brother is a relatively obvious option, and he has been recently dismissed as the Jets OC after two years. The Packers tried to hire Mike LaFleur when Matt was forming his initial coaching staff in 2019, but Kyle Shanahan and the San Francisco 49ers blocked the move. He has generated interest to be coordinator again, even with the Los Angeles Rams under Sean McVay, so it wouldn’t be an easy get.

Joe Brady, Buffalo Bills quarterbacks coach
Brady is just 33 years old and escalated the coaching ladder fast after a brilliant season in 2019 for LSU, where he was the passing game coordinator and wide receivers coach. With a New Orleans Saints background, he was the Carolina Panthers OC for one and a half seasons, but ended up fired as a scapegoat when things started to go south for Matt Rhule. In 2022, he was hired to coach the Bills quarterbacks, and Josh Allen kept the high level of play. The Jets and the Titans have shown interest in him.

Nathaniel Hackett, former Denver Broncos head coach
Hackett wouldn't help as much with different schematic ideas because he has already worked for the Packers from 2019 to 2021 as their offensive coordinator. However, after an unsuccessful one-year tenure as the Broncos head coach, he could be back to help a unit that missed his ability to teach. It would also be a good way to give him a valuable position without firing Stenavich.

Pep Hamilton, Houston Texans offensive coordinator
Hamilton is still under contract with the Texans, but things might change when the team hires a new head coach. Pep Hamilton has a varied background and has spent time with multiple franchises. His first NFL job was with the New York Jets in 2003, under offensive coordinator Paul Hackett (Nathaniel's father). Hamilton had experience as college coordinator for Stanford and Michigan, and in the NFL for the Indianapolis Colts and Houston Texans. He was also the quarterbacks coach of the Chargers in Justin Herbert's rookie season.

Jim Bob Cooter, Jacksonville Jaguars passing game coordinator
Bob Cooter did a good job as the Detroit Lions QBs coach and then offensive coordinator between 2014 and 2018. Since then, he has bounced around the league and currently is the passing game coordinator with a decent performance for the Jacksonville Jaguars, who made the playoffs under head coach Doug Pederson.

Ronald Curry, New Orleans Saints passing game coordinator/quarterbacks coach
Even without a top quarterback and in their first season without head coach Sean Payton, the Saints had still a competent offense, and Andy Dalton played better than anyone could expect at this point of his career. That's why Ronald Curry's background is valuable. He's been with the Saints since 2016, after an initial coaching opportunity with the San Francisco 49ers. Curry was drafted as a quarterback in 2002, but moved to wide receiver and went on to have a solid playing career, mainly for the Oakland Raiders.

Jim Caldwell, former Detroit Lions head coach
The NFL Network has reported that Caldwell is passing other opportunities to be focused on head coaching gigs. However, if he doesn't get a HC job, he could accept another chance to rebuild his value for future opportunities. Caldwell has a great and calm personality, which aligns well with Matt LaFleur, and has a long coaching résumé. He was Peyton Manning's position coach from 2002 to 2008, and then was promoted to be the Indianapolis Colts head coach, reaching the Super Bowl in his first season. He was also the Lions head coach from 2014 to 2017.

Brian Schottenheimer, Dallas Cowboys coaching analyst
Schottenheimer was the offensive coordinator for the Seattle Seahawks during Russell Wilson's best individual years. This season, he has worked for the Dallas Cowboys under Mike McCarthy as a coaching analyst. He had previous coordinator experiences for the New York Jets and St. Louis Rams in the NFL.

Defense
Vic Fangio, former Denver Broncos head coach

Fangio is not that realistic, ok. But he hasn't generated any interest to be a head coach again. He's the hottest name to be Sean Payton's defensive coordinator, but if that doesn't materialize, the veteran coach would be a great addition to help run a system he created and popularized.

Ejiro Evero, Denver Broncos defensive coordinator
Passing Ejiro Evero to hire Joe Barry was a big mistake by LaFleur in 2021. And Evero proved LaFleur wrong in his first season as a coordinator for the Denver Broncos, as their defense was a lonely bright spot in a tough season. Evero has interviewed for multiple head coaching positions, but if he can't get any, the Packers could fix their previous miscue.

Jim Leonhard, former Wisconsin defensive coordinator and interim head coach
Leonard was Matt LaFleur's Plan A in 2021, but he declined the Packers offer to stay with the Badgers. He coordinated Wisconsin's defense for six seasons and was chosen to be the interim head coach after Paul Chryst's firing. He could have multiple choices regarding where to go, and Alabama might be one of them. However, if Leonard is ready to make the jump to the NFL, going to a team that has already shown previous interest makes sense.

Brian Flores, Pittsburgh Steelers assistant head coach/linebackers coach
Flores was a relatively successful head coach for the Miami Dolphins, and his firing generated a lawsuit. Before that, he was a brilliant defensive mind for the New England Patriots. This cycle, he will be interviewed for the Arizona Cardinals HC position and for the Cleveland Browns DC job. If he doesn't get any, the Packers would be a nice option for him.

Vance Joseph, Arizona Cardinals defensive coordinator
Joseph also has head coaching experience, with two seasons leading the Broncos. He did a good job coordinating the Dolphins defense in 2016, and has been a solid coach for the Cardinals since 2019. He will interview for the head coaching position, but might get available if the Cardinals go in another direction, even though he's still under contract as a DC.

Christian Parker, Denver Broncos defensive backs coach
Parker has already worked for the Packers under Matt LaFleur, being their defensive quality control coach in 2019 and 2020. Since 2021, he's coached the Broncos defensive backs, and his work includes awarded seasons for safety Justin Simmons and cornerback Patrick Surtain. He's coached under Mike Pettine, Vic Fangio, and Ejiro Evero.

Eric Henderson, Los Angeles Rams run game coordinator/defensive line coach
Henderson is a well respected position coach. After being an assistant DL coach for the Chargers for two years, he's been with the Rams since 2019. Two offseasons ago, he was promoted to run game coordinator. It's not necessary to say that his background would be pretty useful for the Packers.

Kris Kocurek, San Francisco 49ers defensive line coach
Kocurek is one of the best position coaches in the league. After eight seasons in Detroit and one in Miami, he's been the 49ers DL coach since 2019. The 49ers front is arguably the best in the NFL, and Kocurek has already generated interest to be a coordinator. Shanahan would probably be inclined to block this move, but the Packers should at least give it a try.

Mark Duffner, Cincinnati Bengals senior defensive assistant
The Bengals are a very well coached and situational defense, something the Packers would welcome. Duffner has a background as linebackers coach, coordinating the Bucs defense in 2018. He's been in his current role since 2019.

Jeff Howard, Cleveland Browns pass game coordinator/defensive backs coach
Howard has extensive experience under Mike Zimmer, as he was a defensive assistant for the Minnesota Vikings from 2013 to 2019. Since 2020, he's been a defensive backs coach and passing game coordinator for the Browns. The Browns defense has disappointed, but the secondary has good young pieces developing, and most of the Browns' problems have been upfront.

Photo: Brad Mills-USA TODAY Sports

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Wendell Ferreira covers the Green Bay Packers for Zone Coverage and Cheesehead TV. He is a Brazilian journalist with over a decade of experience covering the NFL, soccer, NBA, and MMA. Follow him on twitter at @wendellfp  

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7 points
 

Comments (63)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
Coldworld's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:10 am

LaFleur shouldn’t hire anyone. He is not even close to good at the things that would free him up for. If he needs help scheming, planning and play calling, he should be kicked out of the door now.

He does and he should be, of course.

12 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

January 16, 2023 at 11:48 am

Do they not have about 25 coaches in the house as it is? They slid the extensions under the table while the Fans were on vacation. I knew it was all downhill for the team, going forward. The repetitive script. The amenable Fans.

5 points
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LambeauPlain's picture

January 16, 2023 at 03:30 pm

Exactly...he is a glorified, highly paid OC...it is all he really manages. The STs and D are of little interest to him during his day job.

2 points
3
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coolhand's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:16 pm

Flower feels Barry is just fine as DC, which tells you all you need to know about his judgement. He also kept Pettine as DC when he was hired, which was almost as bad as hiring Barry.

0 points
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2
stockholder's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:19 am

I don't like recycling losers.

0 points
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5
BirdDogUni's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:24 am

If we're not going to fire the whole damn staff, something needs to happen, because this coaching staff has underwhelmed, despite his first three years at 13 - 3... (Which I attribute to AR12 and #17's heroics, not MaLF or his coaching staff...)

MaLF hanging on to AR12's coattails for dear life isn't a recipe for sustained success.

Still holding out hope the BoD fires Murphy, but that is a fantasy I can't shake. No way they fire Matt LaFleur, but he should be. Again, there's still hope someone pressures MaLF to fire Barry, but it's looking more and more like they're going to try to run it back yet again... Which is the definition of insanity...

Wendell - I have to hand it to you, MaLF hiring an AHC for the Offense and an AHC for the Defense might be the only way to save this team from MaLF and Company.

If Murphy steps in and makes MaLF hire a play designer/play caller, our offense might not suck next year. If we just hire a body guard for Barry, who stands there and makes sure he doesn't call a soft zone 7 yards off the ball on 3rd and 3, we'll be a much better team overall.

The frustration with the FO and Coaching Staff of the Green Bay Packers is evident on every Packer's site, yet without action I see no end in sight, until 2025...

8 points
10
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LLCHESTY's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:20 pm

I think LaFleur is signing his own walking papers if he doesn't fire Barry. They need some toughness in the worst way and it's obvious it won't be coming from the current staff.

5 points
5
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T7Steve's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:45 am

Won't this just add more layers of deniability? Another scape goat? If they could actually hire someone that actually helps and changes things for the better, shouldn't they be considered OC, DC or HC? If not, it should have been done already.

7 points
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splitpea1's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:56 am

What works for the Seahawks might not work for the Packers. It seems to me that the various personalities of our brain trust have enough difficulty getting on the same page as it is. If you're going to make a coaching change, simplify matters by starting at the top first.

8 points
8
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Guam's picture

January 16, 2023 at 11:24 am

This is a solution for a team that refuses to make the hard decisions of firing those who are not getting the job done. Let's hire competent people to surround and support the guy who is failing. Why not just address the root problem and replace the failure?

I've seen this solution too many times in business and it speaks to an organizational unwillingness to seriously address its problems. It is a bandage, not a solution.

11 points
12
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greengold's picture

January 16, 2023 at 11:31 am

LaFleur lost his team more than a year ago capitulating to AR, losing myself as a fan, 100%. He commands nothing as HC for one of the most storied franchises in the history of the NFL.

Sadly, his decision making is poor as a game manager, despite his overall record. Inheriting a very talented team in need of direction & guidance, he caved to our narcissistic QB1’s every whim, fawning over him rather than firmly establishing guidelines to make said QB1, and his team overall, successful.

“His team overall,” thereby lost in the equation.

Matt LaFleur ought to be fired today, but, Mark Murphy… who ought to be fired today by the Packers Board of Directors as well.

Winning Lombardi Trophies is somehow lost on our “Board of Director$.”

4 points
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Bitternotsour's picture

January 16, 2023 at 03:44 pm

Ferreira stops too short. The better move, (or at least the first move) should be hiring John Schneider to replace Mark Murphy, or at a minimum, make him the "Associate President in charge of Football Operations" That way we can prevent Murphy from mucking up the team and the salary cap for another decade in his desperation to have some sort of winning legacy.

Also, mentioning MLF in the same breath/neighborhood as Pete Carroll is blasphemous. Carroll has the respect of his team, and of the NFL. MLF - even his best friends think he's soft. Carroll is a players coach, MLF is a players joke, he's small, and he's fully owned by Aaron Rodgers.

2 points
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marpag1's picture

January 17, 2023 at 03:22 pm

"Associate President in charge of Football Operations"

Absolutely. Because two steering wheels are twice as good as one.

PS - Schneider is overrated.

0 points
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Since'75's picture

January 16, 2023 at 11:33 am

Off subject, but that's ok.

I've brought up a stat called point differential, concerning the vikings that i think is one of the most telling team stats available.
Taryn may remember that.

The vikings ended the season 13-4 with a -2 point differential.

I guess we'll let the results speak to that.

5 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 11:34 am

I mean seriously.....we are talking about LF!

He hired Shawn Mennenga as Special teams coach from 2019 - 2020. He follows him up with Maurice Drayton for 2021. Does anyone really expect any significant coaching changes?

Having said that...and with Wendell writing such a good article I am going to hijack this article a little and interject this for fun, positive, and happy thoughts. Yes, it is very early for the draft but I want to start thinking positive vs about negative this and negative that. Specifically, I would like to generate some conversation and get people looking at Quentin Johnston, WR's Youtube videos.

The WR I have a pre-draft crush on this year is Quentin Johnston, WR from TCU. Guys & gals this is the stud WR and you are going to see me post this many times between now and the draft. If you have not already gone and watched 2 or 3 highlight Youtube videos of this guy....well, it is a must see! Frankly, I can only imagine what having him on the field with fellow WR's like Watson, Doubs & Toure would be like next year. This combination would terrorize opposing defenses & defensive coordinators and as long as the Packers starting QB (Love or Rodgers) has enough time to throw I pity those defensive DB's and Safety's trying to defend him. Is this the next Calvin Johnson player at wide receiver? You want the Packers offense become explosive, well it starts with adding a player like Johnston. Pick-up another OL and a good TE in the draft and hold on to your seats my friends!

At 6'4" and 215 lbs with speed (I have read he runs somewhere between 4.38 and 4.4) the guy is an animal. He is extremely physical and literally throws defenders around & straight arms them. He is a load to bring down. Pretty much any pass that he has to high point it is his. He is so much bigger than all the defenders and appears to be much stronger. Just watching him if there is a contested ball he just rips the ball away from the defender. My mind is exploding with the possibilities of the Packers drafting Johnston in round 1 and having Watson, Doubs, and Toure playing with him.

Of course, the problem is he is likely to be gone anywhere from #7 to say #11 in round 1. With the Packers having the #15 pick they likely will not have a shot at him unless there is some type of trade where the Packers have some draft capital to use to trade up. Any draft capital ideas anyone? :)

I will share that as of now as I look at the other highly rated WR's I personally do not see any WR's including Addison that would have anywhere near the impact Johnston would have on the Packers offense. I like the idea of a bad ass WR who is physical and punishing defenders. I'd like other posters thoughts on this guy if you have watched his Youtube videos. I normally want big guys in the trenches early, but this year Johnston meets the Packers biggest need IMO!

3 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

January 16, 2023 at 11:55 am

He could be gone in the top five. Compares to Dee Dee Lamb. The Pack has to move Down in the first and secure another two pick. The first two rounds have all the playmakers; the best O-linemen.

6 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 11:59 am

I agree....he could even go in the top 5. I am not sure I agree at all about the Dee Lamb comparison as he is much taller, much heavier, and quite a bit more physical IMO.

It is my hope.....that somehow this offseason the Packers come up with some additional draft capital that would allow them to move up in round 1 to go after a player like Johnston, as well as possibly obtaining another round 2 pick. I think it is clear what I mean by coming up with some additional draft capital.

3 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:03 pm

Move some players and use 2024 picks. I would prefer three choices in round two.

2 points
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Racingdad's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:22 pm

I’m in

0 points
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Racingdad's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:17 pm

I agree a lot of good players in 2nd rd. Maybe trade that first for 2seconds and more maybe Carolina? As they have 2 seconds and might be looking for a top qb in first

0 points
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Minniman's picture

January 16, 2023 at 01:00 pm

Knock, this could be yet ANOTHER year with a strong WR draft.

Don't sleep on Jaxon Smith-Njigba from OSU.

He went on IR early this season (which will cruel his draft stock), but he dislodged Garratt Wilson and Chris Olave by late last season as WR1 at OSU (as a sophomore no less!).

Having watched Watson and Doubs this season, I'd be keen to look at a player who compliments their skills and strengths by adding different attacking dimensions (preferably a more polished route runner as well as a slot receiver).

4 points
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Racingdad's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:01 pm

Just think before we won those 4 games we were up to #9 in draft than we win but loose the last game missing playoffs anyway and draft#15 my point is did we really think this team was good enough to go deep into the playoffs? We wasted a chance to see what love has and prepare for better draft picks in every round not just first But oh well I like your choice but sadly he will be long gone I’m afraid to say in that case I think we should at least explore Meyer at te

1 points
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2
T7Steve's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:22 pm

People assume that we'd lose if we'd started Love. Why?

I think we'd have won more games and been in the playoffs if he'd started.

That might have masked more issues like the O-line, D-line, edges and tight ends. That's not even mentioning the coaching or front office issues.

4 points
4
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NickPerry's picture

January 17, 2023 at 06:22 am

I do too Steve...Matter of fact had the Packers started Love starting week 6 after coming home from London, I have no doubt this team would have finished with a winning record, AND we would have had the opportunity to watch Love.

As it is we got a taste for one quarter against the Eagles where he went 6-9 for 113 yards. That doesn't include two drops in the endzone by Cobb and Jones.

1 points
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Racingdad's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:14 pm

Trade ar to raiders for 7th pick that might get johnson

1 points
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1
Coldworld's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:57 pm

I’d trade him for a 7th rounder at this point.

2 points
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13TimeChamps's picture

January 16, 2023 at 03:09 pm

GM's who trade the #7 pick in the draft for a one or two year rental of a 40yo QB with diminishing skills won't be GM's for very long in this league. Besides, the Raiders are more than a QB away from competing for Super Bowls.

2 points
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PackyCheese500's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:16 pm

Let's trade our 3rd round pick to move up! we never do anything with it anyway!

I would still prefer to draft a TE in round 1, probably Michael Mayer. WR is not their biggest need, TE and Safety are. They are struggling to have enough players at those positions to put together a roster

0 points
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1
cheesehead1's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:00 pm

Even though our D played better the last couple of games, that doesn’t excuse the first 14 or 15. I don’t like to see anyone lose their job, but a change at DC is needed.

8 points
8
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Minniman's picture

January 16, 2023 at 01:19 pm

FWIW I agree with your point.

It poses the question of how long it will take Barry to figure out a solution to the next challenge that arises?

After all, it is a game of strategy and counter strategy.

Do we get to endure nearly a full season of watching opposition TE's successfully attack the seam before something is done - as this was the weakness that the Lions exposed.

And what about offensively? Do we get to endure more "Chill Alaska" plays where the slowest WR runs a jet sweep on 4th and inches (I previously posted that if Lazard runs behind the LT and LG and receives a shovel pass [like he did the season before for a redzone TD] then this is a different outcome).

The Packers inability to adjust intra-game is a concern - and that's on the coordinators.

2 points
2
0
BruceC1960's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:01 pm

Don’t they need to check with 12 before they think about hiring new coaches?

7 points
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1
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:22 pm

:)

0 points
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canadapacker's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:08 pm

There are 2 ways forward - One is AR is gone and that probably means that Clements either goes with him or back into retirement. Not sure that I would want Hackett back nor Lafleur's brother. But I do believe that toughness and smartness needs to be brought in. I would like to see Biascca be an assistant defensive head coach - he did good in is other stops as that as well as special teams. I would also like to see Lafleur give up the play calling - even if Love is the QB - he has proven over the past 2 seasons of bad RED ZONE - that he is not the genius that he supposedly is. So he needs to bring in a play caller - who is the best ?? Not sure about those proposed except - new blood - so cross that off the list - as we saw with the Pats - you cant take a D guru and put him in charge of the offense - IF AR is the guy again Lafleur needs to follow take as did MM who gave up the play calling to Clements .

4 points
4
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Slim11's picture

January 16, 2023 at 07:28 pm

If MLF really does give up the play calling, he needs to give it up to someone who can really call good plays. McCarthy did give up play calling to Tom Clements but reclaimed that responsibility later in the season. The trick is finding out who that is. Bringing Hackett back to work with Stenavich might be a decent move. He has knowledge of the offense, probably enjoys the confidence of both MLF and Rodgers and won’t be a HC candidate again any time soon.

On defense, the best step forward is getting rid of Joe Barry. Failing that, Jerry Gray is possibly gone. At least one team, the Falcons, asked for permission to interview him for their DC position. So he may not be an option.

1 points
1
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dobber's picture

January 16, 2023 at 07:57 pm

" I would like to see Biascca be an assistant defensive head coach - he did good in is other stops as that as well as special teams."

Bisaccia hasn't coached defense since Cheers was on TV. RBs and TEs, yes. But mostly STs.

1 points
2
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canadapacker's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:57 pm

I never meant that he was an excellent Defensive coach - but he has been the Head Coach for awhile and Assistant Head Coach several times all the while being Special Teams co-ordinator and maybe he can bring into the Defensive room the dedication to the discipline factor that is important on ST and was not obvious on the Defensive side of the ball. You cannot have successful special teams if you are not doing your job and blocking the back and not playing with passion. That part of being an assistant head coach was assigned to him for a reason not just salary. ""Bisaccia successfully transformed a troubled squad and was able to create a more positive culture for the team by the end of their campaign.""A no-nonsense player’s coach that has come into his own while keeping this team together in the face of adversity""""

1 points
1
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Packer_Fan's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:21 pm

Yes, hire more coaching talent. We need more input to make player changes sooner. We need more creativity in the offense. We need someone to challenge Barry. We need help to better coach people up. And we need more player discipline

1 points
2
1
jannes bjornson's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:59 pm

Players, not Plays...

0 points
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Leatherhead's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:25 pm

I'm not a big fan of following the model of less successful franchises. People who say we should follow the example of the Bears, Vikings, or Lions never really persuade me, but Seattle is a little different. First, it's got a Green Bay guy at the helm (Schneider). Secondly, Seattle has been a pretty successful franchise, going to the playoffs 15 times in 20 years.

I've heard it said, by the Green Bay coaches, that maybe the turnover in coaching contributed to the general lack of discipline, so if we're going to add coaches or not, that should be a focus. On defense, lack of discipline was part of the problem of these huge gash plays we surrender. On offense, we simply made too many mistakes to overcome: Missed blocks, turnovers, dropped passes, wrong routes, etc. etc. etc.

Last year, when Seattle was last in their division, nobody was saying "We should be more like Seattle". This year, they made the move with their QB and were still competitive without him. Imagine that.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

If you watched San Diego blow the huge lead, and if you watched the Bengals return a fumble at the goal line for a 98 yard TD, then you know that if you actually make the playoffs, stuff can happen. The people who think that making the playoffs is an unworthy goal, and that's it's Super Bowl or nothing, are missing the point, IMO. Win your division, make the playoffs, and hope for the best. That's all you can do .

3 points
6
3
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:34 pm

LH,
Glad you did not take that hiatus as you have expressed. We need your input along with all the other amazing posters CCTV has.

"Last year, when Seattle was last in their division, nobody was saying "We should be more like Seattle". This year, they made the move with their QB and were still competitive without him. Imagine that".

NEVER FORGET THOUGH and this is what some posters try avoiding......Seattle's front office actually made the correct trade and got something like 2 first round picks, 2 seconds, a fifth, Shelby, Fant, and Lock while the Packers sat on their asses and threw their cap money down the drain on an aging QB. Ooppps,,,,,sorry but if you are going to bring up Seattle for comparison than you cannot overlook the TRADE of the decade.

6 points
7
1
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:47 pm

Furthermore, it may be worthwhile to research and look at how much cap space was freed up with the Russell trade, and whether the Seahawks picked up a bunch of good FA's in 2022 as well.

2 points
2
0
Leatherhead's picture

January 16, 2023 at 01:01 pm

The negativity overwhelms me at times, especially since so much of it is unnecessary, and even unfounded. I always think one solution is better than 100 gripes.

People here are saying we're rudderless, being steered by a bunch of incompetent buffoons. That's 100% nonsense, IMO.

I think Seattle made the right move. I wish the Packers had done the same. They didn't. Water under the bridge. New season is already starting.

If you look at Seattle, and Jacksonville, and the Bengals, and others, you'll see stark evidence of what I've said for many years: No team is ever more than two years away from the playoffs+..IF they make the right moves. The predictions that we're going to suck forever are just not based on anything real, IMO.

I think if the Seahawks can get to the playoffs with Geno, we can do the same with Love.

2 points
4
2
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 03:35 pm

I hear you and understand what you are saying but once again the Packers are at a crossroad this offseason just like last year. It isn't quite water under the bridge because we are facing the same issue again this offseason. One cannot be an ostrich and choose to ignore. What do you think the front office should do this offseason? Continue to roll with a 40-year old QB next year whose talents appear to be diminishing while the team is in rebuild and unlikely to be a strong playoff team, or do you trade Rodgers this offseason and possibly get an extra 1st rounder, and if lucky maybe a little more to help turn your team around quicker?

1 points
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Leatherhead's picture

January 16, 2023 at 05:57 pm

""""" What do you think the front office should do this offseason""""

I think that Love was drafted for a reason. Put him on the field. If he sucks, and the Packers suck, then it's probably time for a housecleaning since this plan has been in place for years.

So I'd start Love. I'd rebuild our Big 3 on offense around Love, Watson, and Dillon or a draft pick. I'd bring back Bakhtiari, Nijman, all the guys under contract, and I'd draft another offensive lineman on Day 2. I'd add to the group of complementary skill players....Doubs, Toure, Deguara, etc. Jones, Lazard, Lowry, Amos....all salary cap casualties.

If Rodgers wants to retire, fine. If he wants to keep playing, fine, we'll trade him. If he has a specific place he'd like to be traded, then maybe we could work out something that would help our cap situation if we accomodate him.

Rolling with the MVP is one thing. Rolling with a guy who you don't think can get you to the tile is another thing.

Personally, I think we could contend for the Division title next year.

3 points
3
0
PackyCheese500's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:29 pm

It will be at lest one more year before we can have a possibility of returning to being rulers of the North. The Lions should be the favorites, and the Bears should be massively improved. The Vikings I think are set for a steep decline, as a lot of their success was luck this year.

I would release Bakh out of pure salary cap necessity. We need the cap relief that a post June 1st trade or release would provide. Same with Jones, although we probably want to cut/trade him before June 1st. Amos, Reed, Lowry, and Tonyan are all expendable, and I don't think we will be able to or should pay Lazard 11m/year to stay.

I would also like to see him traded. Most likely to the NY Jets; they could easily create enough cap room and are the perfect destination.

I would take Michael Mayer, the Notre Dame TE, at pick 15. We need a real playmaker at TE, and he can add to the offensive trio you mentioned.

2 points
3
1
BirdDogUni's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:41 pm

I'm with you Lh, but it's all up to AR12...

In fact, I think he'll tell Murphy and Gutey what "will" happen.

I don't think they have the cojones to trade him unless he specifically asks for one and I don't think he will... If they did have the cojones, they would've last off season...

4 points
4
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Leatherhead's picture

January 17, 2023 at 12:29 am

I don’t think it’s all up to AR. The ball is in his court now while he decides what he wants, but the organization also has an agenda,
.if he retires, fine.
If he wants to play, we’ll trade him and go with Love.
If we trade him to a place he wants to go, I’d hope there might be some financial concessions.
If we trade him to a place he doesn’t want to go, he can retire.

Last year, I suspect that the calculus was that we’d have a better chance with Rodgers. Now, I suspect the calculations have changed..

0 points
0
0
PhantomII's picture

January 17, 2023 at 08:32 pm

Our OL was AFU half the season and we let our mostly serviceable RT walk and Bak and Jenkins were not ready.
When DA was our #1 WR..we never-EVER had a #2 WR. Our TE was not ready at the beginning of the season Gary got hurt Early and our rookie had to be put in his place, all the time Bary refused to play Wyatt and our ALL-Pro ILB was injured for a long while. Our bandaid WR corp of vets did mostly nothing and the 2 rookies that played that position took turns with injuries. I don't like ML run game at all, the closest point is straight ahead, so I like big bad ass OL who move Big DL around. I like TE's who can help a little in the run, but mostly who are good pass catchers. IF YOU HAVE TO USE A TE TO BLOCK...YOU NEED BIGGER OL.... We are still missing a #1 WR and probably #2 depending on how Rooks turn around next season. This season was going nowhere from the get go, especially without an elite possession WR to move the chains. As usual our run game gets shut down for 3 years straight. Bigger OL...More offensive weapons are the cure.

0 points
0
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:17 pm

I appreciate hearing your response LH. Thanks!

I just want a pro active front office that can make good short term and long term decisions that are going to turn around this team on the field vs just thinking about what is best financially.

0 points
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BirdDogUni's picture

January 17, 2023 at 09:27 pm

So, you'll have to wait until 2025 then huh? When Murphy is gone?

0 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 19, 2023 at 11:45 am

BD,
I sure hope it doesn't take that long but than again....who knows with the way things are done in that front office.

0 points
0
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Qoojo's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:46 pm

The biggest problem i see is that the defense does not swarm or know how to tackle. Defense appears passive most of the time. When they aren't passive like the 2nd MN game, they look pretty good. A recurring theme this year was one guy making a tackle while 2+ guys watched.

Can the packers hire a coach that can tell the defense to not line up with the first down marker in front of them on 3rd and long? Then when the ball is caught in front of them, back tackling ensues. Cue Benny Hill theme. This team needs a lot more practice tackling even if it does increase the risk of injury.

3 points
3
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croatpackfan's picture

January 16, 2023 at 12:46 pm

Wendel, despite I appreciate Jim Caldwell, I do not think he will bring much positive to the Packers if Packers hire him.

"Caldwell has a great and calm personality, which aligns well with Matt LaFleur, and has a long coaching résumé." Packers need someone who will lite the fire under the players (and MLF, of course) not another nice guy who can talk nicely...

0 points
1
1
PackyCheese500's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:30 pm

Mike Zimmer would be the guy to revitalize the culture in our defense. He will shake the wimpy culture out of the locker room like dust on a rug.

0 points
1
1
BirdDogUni's picture

January 16, 2023 at 07:19 pm

Zimmer is a loser. Last guy we need.

0 points
1
1
Ikrispy's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:28 pm

I think we need to resign ourselves as Packer fans to this regime’s commitment to mediocrity. There will be no addition of creativity or even a deviation from what the past couple of seasons has produced: a team that can play well but won’t in the clutch.

4 points
5
1
calabasa's picture

January 16, 2023 at 02:35 pm

The Packers should hire John Schneider; someone who has the guts to trade his QB for a boatload of picks.

Oh wait.

3 points
4
1
PhantomII's picture

January 16, 2023 at 03:14 pm

I wanted him more than Gute originally, but he trades off good players constantly and they are very mediocre after the first 2 SB appearances. He hit a big bunch of defensive players in a couple drafts. He did get max value for a washed up underperforming QB who went to an Ideal team with a good offense and defense and did "NOTHING" except get the coach fired. It's hard to see how an Elway QB cannot seem to find an up and coming QB with the traits it takes to be better than below average NFL QB.

2 points
2
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PhantomII's picture

January 16, 2023 at 03:03 pm

What the packers should do is hire a prolific offensive and defensive coach to critique every aspect of this teams operation moves in pre game plan, actual game calls, adjustments, personnel, down and distance and execution. These guys don't seem able to do 50% of it as is and I will say Gute has not helped as much as he could have with a more solid OL, TE and WR#1 this past season which is why I believe we saw such a downgrade in our offense. We also got rid of our RT in the offseason. GPG

2 points
2
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LLCHESTY's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:16 pm

"Jim Bob, get away from that Cooter!"

0 points
1
1
BAMABADGER's picture

January 16, 2023 at 06:30 pm

I've said it before.... Nothing will change until July 13, 2025 when Alfred E. Newman is forced to retire at age 70. Accept that we have the Head Cheerleader running the football team until Alfred leaves.

"Same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was."

2 points
3
1
LeotisHarris's picture

January 16, 2023 at 09:06 pm

Successful organizations strive for continuous improvement and have systems in place to ensure that process occurs. As HC, LaFleur should have a view from the stratagem to provide him with information to facilitate growth in his coordinators and their staff. In turn, there should be a support system for him to enhance his skills as a HC. All of this should translate into improved play on the field in all areas of the game. High expectations. Accountability. A culture of continuous improvement.

I am a Green Bay Packer fan, always will be. I was an enthusiastic fan of LaFleur's first two 13-win teams. The third seemed destined for an unhappy ending, and this season was infuriating with the lackluster performances and feeble leadership. Stale. Predictable. Throwing the same shit at the wall to see if it would stick.

Bart Starr stepped into the Packers HC role, admittedly, unqualified for the position. He learned a great deal about being an NFL HC (and GM for the first 5 years of his tenure) while guiding the team to a disappointing 52-76-3 record over nine seasons. He fired longtime teammate and Packers legend Hawg Hanner as DC in 1979 and brought up John Meyer, the LB coach. Some say Bart was just getting his HC shit together when he was shown the door in favor of Forrest Gregg. That was an ugly time in Packers history.

My opinion, based on what I've seen from Coach LaFleur, is he came to this HC position without the necessary skills to be successful in his role and has not developed leadership skills to fill that gap. He's not a natural leader. I think the beta male digs and shots at his appearance are cheap. He cried? Meet Dick Vermeil. He doesn't look like Dan Campbell or Mike Vrabel? Say hello to Marv Levy and Weeb Eubank. He's not a get-in-your-face tough guy? Tom Landry and Tony Dungy are here to have a chat with you. Successful coaches, like humans, look and act differently. That said, I don't think he's on the cusp of figuring it out as Bart may or may not have been.

Which brings me to Wendell's fine point of getting some mentors for the kids. I'd feel better about leadership that knew what to do with all the data and resources available to them. What will it take for that to happen in Green Bay?

7 points
7
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 16, 2023 at 10:19 pm

Leotis,
I enjoyed that...thanks!

0 points
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