Was Sunday's Victory a Turning Point for the Packers' Youth Movement?
The young bucks are starting to shine.
By rex.sheild
When your team is largely filled with youth and inexperience, the odds are stacked against you to win football games consistently. After all, the National Football League is a grown man’s league and, generally speaking, rewards teams that are veteran-laden, with talented, young players sprinkled in. So the challenge for young teams, like the Green Bay Packers, is learning how to win football games, particularly close ones. Entering Sunday, five of the Packers’ nine games were one-score affairs; the team was 1-4 in those five contests.
The Week 11 victory may turn out to be inconsequential in the grand scheme of the 2023 season. But maybe, just maybe, it represents a turning point, where head coach Matt LaFleur’s young, inexperienced team learned how to win in crunch time and can carry that confidence with them over the final seven games and possibly beyond.
Should Sunday’s showdown between the Class of 2020 quarterbacks have even been as close as it was? Probably not. The Los Angeles Chargers, who have played their fair share of close games this season, seemingly squandered opportunity after opportunity. In the second half alone, wide receiver Keenan Allen dropped what would have been a touchdown on third down to start the third quarter. Running back Austin Ekeler fumbled at the two-yard line in a goal-to-go situation. Wide receiver Quentin Johnston dropped a perfect ball from quarterback Justin Herbert on the team’s last offensive drive that could have been taken to the house, or at the very least, put the Chargers in field goal range. And there were plenty of other drops throughout.
Make no mistake about it, though, the Packers’ young offensive weapons stepped up and the defense did just enough, especially in the red zone. One week removed from throwing for 289 yards, a career-high, quarterback Jordan Love one-upped that performance with the best game of his career. He finished 27-of-40 (67.5%) for 322 yards and two touchdowns, to go along with a passer rating of 108.5. It was the franchise’s first 300-yard performance through the air since December 12, 2021, when then-Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers threw for 341 yards in a 45-30 victory against the Chicago Bears.
Best of all, when Green Bay needed Love the most, down 20-16 with roughly five minutes remaining, Love delivered the goods, orchestrating a six-play, 75-yard touchdown drive that put the Packers on top for good.
Per @ESPNStatsInfo: Love now has three go-ahead touchdown passes in the fourth quarter this season -- most by a Packers QB since Aaron Rodgers with three in 2012. https://t.co/ojDe4yxUJf
— Rob Demovsky (@RobDemovsky) November 19, 2023
Another young player who stepped up on that go-ahead drive? Rookie wide receiver Dontayvion Wicks. The fifth-round selection drew a pass interference call on third-and-20 and then, two plays later, made a strong body catch after absorbing the contact and eluded would-be tacklers, resulting in a 35-yard gain. Love connected with wide receiver Romeo Doubs for a touchdown two plays later. Wicks finished the day with a team-high 91 yards on three receptions (five targets).
Rookie wide receiver Jayden Reed continued the trend of flashing his speed and electric playmaking ability on the football field. He scored the team’s first touchdown of the afternoon on an end-around from 32 yards out, in which he was not touched by a single defender. He also tacked on four receptions for 46 yards. For the season, the Michigan State product has 32 receptions for 463 yards and five touchdowns and is on pace for one of the best rookie seasons by a wide receiver in franchise history over the last 30-plus years, as pointed out by Ryan Wood of the Green Bay-Press Gazette. (“Only Sterling Sharpe’s rookie season with 55 catches, 791 yards and one touchdown in 1988 compares.”)
Reed and Wicks combined for seven receptions (11 targets), 183 all-purpose yards, and one touchdown against the Chargers. For what it’s worth, Doubs and Christian Watson combined for seven receptions (10 targets), 75 all-purpose yards, and two touchdowns.
Even rookie tight end Tucker Kraft, the team’s 2023 third-round selection who has slowly come along this season, showed his athletic prowess on a 27-yard reception that eventually set up a Watson touchdown reception at the end of the third quarter.
Team president Mark Murphy said before the regular season began that the defense was going to have to carry the offense in the first half of the season as the offense adjusted to a brand-new starting quarterback and a bunch of young offensive weapons. Murphy’s observation did not turn out to be wrong. In the tenth game of the season, the offense looked far more competent than they have at many times throughout the season and showed serious growth, despite missing running backs Aaron Jones and Emanuel Wilson for the second half due to injuries.
“Just really proud of our group,” LaFleur said after the game. “I feel like they are growing. They are continuing to battle. I feel like we’re getting better.”
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Rex is a lifelong Packers fan but was sick of the cold, so he moved to the heart of Cowboys country. Follow him on Twitter (@Sheild92) and Instagram (@rex.sheild).
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Comments (50)
PatrickGB
November 20, 2023 at 12:25 pm
Bodes well for the future.
Bitternotsour
November 20, 2023 at 12:27 pm
Sunday was a random data point. Not a turning point. Hopefully the next coach can utilize the random data points and assemble something resembling a robust identity. The truly good news from the weekend is that even naysayers can see NFL talent at important positions.
HarryHodag
November 20, 2023 at 01:27 pm
No coaching/GM change for at least two more seasons. MLF and Gute signed extensions and Murphy (their supervisor) is around next year and won't be retired until July, 2025. It makes zero sense to unload folks now and start over since they're....starting over. With Sean Payton off the market, there's no veteran coach with a winning record available. Jim Harbaugh is the only other candidate and he has signed an extension with Michigan.
So like it or not, MLF and Gute are around two more seasons. By the end of 2024 it will be plainly evident whether this group will lead the Packers back to the promised land. All the 'rookies' will be experienced, as will be Jordan Love. The cap will be back in line after 2024 so the Packers will have an opportunity to be in good shape. I heard on the 'Nine to Noon' show from a reporter that the Packers are likely to hire a current insider as the new CEO so the idea of new management will not likely occur.
White92
November 20, 2023 at 06:21 pm
I hate how likely this is
SicSemperTyrannis
November 20, 2023 at 11:57 pm
Nobody in the FO will be leading to any promised land. Ditto for coaches with possible exceptions of Tom Clements and Rich Bisaccia.
I fear you are right.
Could still be a good team.
Since'75
November 21, 2023 at 04:18 am
Harry...I'm pretty damn sure Gute and MLF are around for 1 more year for sure.'
If they hire a new President from the outside in 2025 then i don't know if they stick around.
Unless......They Put Russ Ball or Ed Policy in the Presidents chair, which is what i think is going to happen.
**************
Afterthought.......
If they do hire someone from within, AND the Packers finish 2024 at .500 or under.
Under that scenario, if Gute and MLF are kept on, i think that officially takes us back to the 70's and 80's.
I know, i know....i'm sorry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 😞
But that's the way i see it.
******************
What i'm interested in seeing is, when Murphy leaves in 2025, does he put the bylaws back to where Harlan put them, giving the GM full football authority...where it should be.
******************
In a entertaining way, i'm amused by people doing the downvote, and don't have the intellect to voice why, or their opinion.
I can't help but thinking...are you that childish, petty, and mentally bankrupt.
I mean, in a way i feel sorry for you people.
Is that your way of getting your daily jollies?
Ray-66
November 21, 2023 at 10:39 am
Russ Ball
Coldworld
November 20, 2023 at 02:36 pm
Definitely encouraging from an individual player point of view. Not seeing growth in the coaching, particularly OL and D. If anything we saw two poorly coached teams in a battle of who makes the key screw ups. It’s encouraging that that was the opponent, but still we ran them close.
SicSemperTyrannis
November 20, 2023 at 11:59 pm
Exactly, clash of the incompetents.
Good teams did play yesterday, just not in GB. Lots of individual efforts :)
Fewer penalties, fewer drops. Hopefully we get two RBs back ...
TarynsEyes
November 20, 2023 at 12:40 pm
They've made some incremental strides toward what everyone wants them to be, but true strides need to be gotten and then made consistent against the better teams. The Lions will be a good barometer in their play since the first game.
The future has a possible shine rising, but I'd hold off on wearing the sunglasses just yet, because the eye protection needed may still be of another kind. Let's see what happens against a couple of better teams in a row, and then see if they can keep from sliding down the bad team road against the Giants, yet again.
A strong sense of growth needs to be seen over the next two games, that's what we bring me in for the future.
MainePackFan
November 20, 2023 at 01:29 pm
"The Lions will be a good barometer in their play since the first game."
Agreed. I'm looking for consistency as this team moves forward. I fully expect they will lose the next two games, mainly because they are playing better teams, plus we have no idea who replaces Jones and Wilson at RB. I have no issue when they're beaten by a better team as long as they're competitive and don't beat themselves.
My hope is this team can finish strong and continue to grow. I think, based on the schedule, this team can go 4-3 the rest of the way . There is only one team with a better than .500 record in the last 5 games, so it's not an unrealistic goal.
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:02 am
I just look for good effort. There should be some development that way even without a coach that's worth a damn.
Packerpasty
November 20, 2023 at 03:20 pm
I agree..you have play the teams in your division well, split for the season at the least...and I want to see them play a good team well, win or lose...not these mistake filled bottom of the NFL teams...show me something the next two weeks..
Since'75
November 20, 2023 at 06:17 pm
IMO.....I don't think one game is a barometer.
As fans....I think you let the season play out and then take a good look at what they did well, and what they didn't do well, and assess it from there.
Pretty much what all NFL teams do at seasons end.
TarynsEyes
November 20, 2023 at 06:25 pm
It isn't the end all barometer, but it's the one game at this point to assess the incremental strides supposedly achieved because it's the only team GB will have played twice. A comparison of growth from one to the next.
Why do so many feel the need to read more into what is actually said?
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:04 am
Could be very difficult to assess anything in Detroit. What matchup do we have that we might win? Valentine will be tested, he might show up big.
TarynsEyes
November 21, 2023 at 12:25 am
Look at it from a basic point of view. How do they take the punches that were thrown last time and now? Do they absorb them or still get knocked on their ass? Are they able to counter better than before? Geez, it isn't rocket science. The answers to the question are easy to see. When you fought someone and got beat, did you learn how to fight that person better or get ass kicked the same or worse next time. This applies to any type of matchup. Were you able to inflict more damage than before, or were you as incompetent?
Guam
November 20, 2023 at 03:53 pm
At this point I am looking more for individual growth and development than I am team progress. Between a talent deficit on the O-line, injuries in the secondary and questionable coaching everywhere, I doubt this team is ready for the Lions or the Chiefs. The last four games may be a better barometer for the team as a whole.
My greatest wish is that Jordan Love continues to develop sufficiently over the last six games that it is reasonable to believe he is the next franchise quarterback. If the Packers have to go back to the well again for another QB, it could set the rebuild back several years.
MainePackFan
November 20, 2023 at 06:30 pm
"My greatest wish is that Jordan Love continues to develop sufficiently over the last six games that it is reasonable to believe he is the next franchise quarterback."
" questionable coaching everywhere"
Guam, I struggle to understand how you reconcile these two statements. If the coaching is questionable, how do players get better? The individual growth is only a reality if the coaches do what is necessary to bring out the growth. This either happens or it doesn't, but I don't think those two things can be separated.
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:09 am
They're completely separated so far. What position coach is helping any player develop mid season?
Even Tom Clements, JL is making the same mistakes. He learned how to throw the ball away instead of talking the sack in Pittsburgh, and that stuck with him yesterday. Clements didn't teach him that. He's still trying to thread needles from a mile away, which this team simply isn't ready for and neither is JL.
Any individual development, these guys are on their own.
MainePackFan
November 21, 2023 at 05:58 am
How would any of us know what Tom Clements said to JL? if your position is that the coaches suck, but the players can get better on their own, why do we need coaches at all?
The premise that this coaching staff doesn't coach seems to be a popular take with some in here. The argument that we need better coaches may be a valid one, but if the players show improvement every week it's difficult to quantify to what degree the coaches input contributes or hinders that development.
Guam
November 21, 2023 at 08:05 am
Fair question MPF and needs a two part answer. Part one is I believe players can get better on their own through self study and individual hard work. Good coaching would certainly help the process significantly, but poor coaching does not mean no individual progress. Secondly, questionable coaching also relates to scheme which is not about individual player development, but putting the team in position to succeed or fail and our current coaching staff seems to favor failure too often (think Joe Barry having our CBs play seven yards off on a third and three - very hard for the team to succeed even if the player executes properly).
MainePackFan
November 21, 2023 at 09:02 am
Thanks for the reply Guam. I'm talking more on the offensive side of the ball.
I guess my point is that all season long we have blamed the coaches for not properly developing the players, yet when the players show signs of improvement, the coaches get no credit.
Either the scheme has changed, or the players have learned and developed. Both choices would seem to involve coaches, unless we think they just toss them a playbook and head to the local bar. Even if that's the case, it seems to be working, so they deserve credit : )
The coaches suck because the players aren't getting better, and the coaches suck when the players are getting better. Sounds like a no-win situation for the coaches ; )
As far as Joe Barry, he has never been a successful DC. This defense will continue to be the definition of insanity as long as he is the DC. On that, we can agree.
Guam
November 21, 2023 at 10:21 am
MPF: My example was Barry, but I have concerns on the offensive side as well although there has been improvement of late.
I'll buy that Love and the receivers are improving (maybe significantly) and give Clements and Vrabel credit for that. On the other hand, the O-line seems to be regressing. I simply don't understand some of the moves made by Steno/Butkus. Starting Walker over Nijman for seven games when Walker was clearly struggling, rotating Walker/Nijman and Runyon/Rhyan, and sticking with Myers at center just feels like dubious coaching to me.
Regarding LaFleur, he is responsible for Barry, Mennenga, Drayton, Stenavich and Butkus as well as the offense's inability to make in-game adjustments for several years. That is certainly questionable coaching to me although most of it is not related to player development.
We both agree on Barry - he needs to go.
MainePackFan
November 21, 2023 at 02:47 pm
I agree, loyalty seems to be a weakness with Lafleur, as well as in-game adjustments. I do think in spite of Lafleur's shortcomings, if this team continues to show improvement , he has done his job and held this young team together.
I know I am in the minority in here, but I don't think firing Lafleur is a viable solution at this point.
splitpea1
November 20, 2023 at 12:41 pm
As far as the development of the QB, WRs, and TEs go, the arrow is definitely trending upward; the blocking, route-running, and knowledge of the offense is very much improved. But the running game continues to be an Achilles heel, and another youth movement here is going to be needed to balance the equation; we've pretty much seen the ceiling of what our current players is concerning this aspect of the offense, and we're going to need to raise it significantly with a fresh infusion of talent.
A better yardstick of progress will come a couple of days away against the Lions. Let's see how far we've come seven games after the last drubbing.
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:13 am
We have no idea what #31 Wilson's ceiling is. Goodson was let go, as was Nichols.
Nothing about the passing game is known from this game except the opponent gives up on average 296 yards per game. GB barely beat that.
Since'75
November 20, 2023 at 01:16 pm
"When your team is largely filled with youth and inexperience, the odds are stacked against you to win football games consistently."
Whose fault is that?
Oh yea, upper management
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Nice cherry picking Demovsky on the 4th quarter TD's find.
How long did that one take you to dig up?....😁
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Turning point?
Taryan has it exactly right
Consistency
Growth
This was one game people
Yes, enjoy it, but a turning point?
Can the Pack win a few in a row, even 2 in a row?
Can we beat a team with a solid defense?
The bright spot to me if there was one, is Clark and Gary making plays.
Making a difference.
That's why they make the huge money isn't it?
I would even (dare i say) like to see more of it.
T7Steve
November 20, 2023 at 02:19 pm
Your growth list should include not being manhandled by bullies.
Start becoming the bulls.
Coldworld
November 20, 2023 at 05:12 pm
This Thursday will be a good test of whether we have come up with a game plan and attitude that can challenge Campbell’s. The last few times he’s beaten us soundly
MainePackFan
November 20, 2023 at 06:56 pm
While I agree with the gist of your post, the attitude won't come from the coaches. It will come from the players. The Lions have bullied this team for a couple years now. Campbells tough guy act only works if there are tough guys willing to do the dirty work. Your Dad telling you to punch a bully means nothing if you aren't willing to punch the bully.
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:14 am
I think the outcome of that challenge is pretty obvious. I'm just hoping for a good effort, because it builds character.
LambeauPlain
November 20, 2023 at 01:23 pm
Finally a fun weekend for Saturday and Sunday football. Badgers and Packers both pulled out wins that looked like losses. Any win is a good win.
Packers won with a highly encouraging developmental performance by Love. I truly want to see the young man succeed. He is only going to get better. Already he shows poise, leadership, improving decision making, and an NFL arm. Still needs more work at the range "sighting it in", but he can throw it!
The OL played well, especially pass blocking. Nijman looked good and more consistent than Walker, who also played well then not so well. I don't understand the musical chairs at LT. Anyone know?
The D remains a soft defense against the run. Everyone in the NFL knows you will easily move the ball on the Packers. The saving grace for Barry Ball is turnovers (the great equalizer) and luck (dropped balls, fumbled snaps, stupid penalties, etc). Lady Luck was the heroine for the D yesterday. Chargers left a cornucopia of points on the field. I will take it!
STs are both hot and cold. Whelan has a field flipping howitzer for a leg. Heath is a demon on teams. Carlson is getting a bit wobbly. His plant foot on the miss to right was in front of the ball.
There is player talent on this very young Packer team. And the youngest team in the NFL would greatly benefit from better coaching. My guess is Murphy will stay status quo until the gold watch is in his pocket.
So Murphy saying "the defense needs to carry the offense..." was a correct analysis...and dysfunctional after retaining Barry for a 3rd year. If he truly believed this, would he not insist MLF find the best DC possible? And that guy was Joe Barry??
Happy Thanksgiving to you and your families! Hope our dinners are even tastier with W!
RCPackerFan
November 20, 2023 at 01:30 pm
This game felt like a game that they turned a point. But for me it wasn't based solely on this game. It has been cumulating. But this game to me felt like it was the light bulb went off game. When everything just really clicked for them offensively.
Love had by far his best game. He had some throws I'm sure he'd love to have back. Mostly the Musgrave miss. But he was on point and made some great decisions. We got down to 1 RB and it didn't really slow the offense down much. Love was still dealing.
Its not just Love though that we are seeing growth from. We got to see all the pass catchers getting involved. We got to see our 2 young TE's making plays. Kraft finally got involved and nearly made a great TD. Even though he didn't score that is the type of play that has to make them be like damn, we got to get this guy more opportunities.
This young offense definitely took a step. The best part about this though, is they didn't play a perfect game. They still have room for improvement. Its always great when you can win and still have stuff to work at to get better.
T7Steve
November 20, 2023 at 02:29 pm
The master of understatement, "They still have room for improvement."
It's exciting because they can do a "house full" of improvement?
How 'bout "condominiums of"
"Field house"
A coliseum of improvement for these young fellas.
Razer
November 20, 2023 at 01:59 pm
Many gaps on this roster on both the O-line, D-line, RB, safety and CB so the corner is still down the road. We seem to have stocked the WR and TE rooms over the last two drafts but we will need at least two more drafts to build other areas of the team. And, I am still not sold on this coaching staff. We have seen 3 years of missed assignments and soft defense. I am seeing a lot of average.
But, I saw guys playing hard on Sunday and that is a good start to maturing and improving.
GVPacker
November 20, 2023 at 03:42 pm
"I'm Not Sold On The Coaching Staff" I'm with you on that Razer! The Packer D Is giving up way too many big plays
Joe Barry needs to go!
fireball
November 20, 2023 at 02:21 pm
" turning point "? I don't know. Maybe. Or maybe they just got lucky because the jerk head coach went conservative at the very end calling asshole running plays ( when everyone knows they don't have a decent running back worth a shit ) and gave the Chargers a chance to get within field goal distance to tie the game. Man oh man oh man I just knew that LaFleur was going to run the ball on that last series! And sure enough. . .
And now Aaron Jones is out! Wow. Pathetic, just pathetic. Talk about no running game. Now every team coming up will just dare Love to pass. They will load up at the scrimmage line. Dillon's only worth at this point is that, so far, he's at least capable of holding up while running into a brick wall again and again.
T7Steve
November 20, 2023 at 02:34 pm
They have to learn how to enjoy a win for one day.
I'm trying too.
PASSdaRELISH
November 20, 2023 at 03:00 pm
What’s more concerning to me about Valentine getting beat at the end of the game is WHY it happened. He gave up on the play instead of playing through the whistle. If it wasn’t for the drop, it would’ve costed us the game. I hope he learns from this and becomes the great player I believe he will.
BAMABADGER
November 20, 2023 at 03:05 pm
Was Sunday's Victory a Turning Point for the Packers' Youth Movement?
No, one game can not answer this question. Let's hope for the best. This also does not excuse the poor coaching performance all year. Changes in staff still need to be made before or after the end of the season. Yesterday, we won by beating another team that beat themselves.
GPG!
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:21 am
They have the worst pass defense in the league, giving up an average 296 yards per game. GB barely beat that. Don't get too excited. ..
ricky
November 20, 2023 at 03:14 pm
What is particularly interesting is the apparent reshuffling going on in the WR room. Watson was presumed to be the #1, with Doubs being #1-A. Instead, it is Reed and Wicks who are emerging as playmakers. Which is fine with me. I don't care where a guy was drafted, or what school he came from. Can he perform on the field and make a difference? If yes, you have yourself a keeper. Watson, in particular, is going to have to get luckier with the injuries, or be ready to move on when his contract expires. Am I saying he's a bust? Absolutely not. But he has become one of those "when healthy" players; and his impact on the field is less than one would expect with his size and speed. He still has two years to prove himself worthy of being an important part of the offense. But if the other WRs continue to develop, Watson could find himself playing in a different uniform.
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:22 am
Reed is WR1. Musgrave and Wicks should be getting the other targets, depending on who's open.
Packerpasty
November 20, 2023 at 03:22 pm
No running game for the Turkey Day Special?? Yikes...
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:23 am
Any word on #33 or 31? They might be ok
Rudedawg67
November 20, 2023 at 04:09 pm
Turning point for the offense maybe. San Diego is far from a top notch defense. The problem is even if they miraculously make the playoffs they will get literally run out of the stadium by San Francisco or Philadelphia. Their strength is our weakness, the run game. Until the run defense is fixed we will just be an after thought in the playoffs come February.
SicSemperTyrannis
November 21, 2023 at 12:24 am
Not to worry.
Can GB get 1 more W?
Qoojo
November 20, 2023 at 05:08 pm
I do not see it as any turning point. I do think they finally found one thing on offense that they can rely on with Reed.
I think the come back drive was very beneficial. I feel the win was more about Chargers self-inflicted mistakes with 4 unforced crucial drops. I think 2 of the drops would have been TDs.
Just like the packers inconsistency and drops earlier led to losses. The packers youngsters got first hand experience what it's like when the other team self-destructs.
On offense, the OL really struggled with the run.
White92
November 20, 2023 at 06:28 pm
The Packers did some nice things, but they were also extremely lucky. It's fine because there are times they are extremely unlucky. The thing we need to see is consistency. They are guilty of stinking until they consistently prove otherwise.