Well, Al, regarding "Shades of MM" I have 2 observation. I placed post that father time catch Aaron Rodgers. He has in the past from time to time once a while off pass, but in the 1st half of the Cheatriots game he had 4 - one was pick six. Second observation is that he is not enjoying in football any more, at least not at the level he did in the past. You can say that by his reactions after good or bad outcome of the play. Is that the problem because many teams playing vs Aaron Rodgers under the QB playing Tampa 2, that he is "robbed" of his most enjoyable (for him) deep passes or there is something else, I do not know.

Maybe things will turn around and we will see Aaron Rodgers again in the game completely in. I do not know. But from the end of the last season he does not look as completely concentrated to the game. Maybe it is me, making wrong judgement, or I do not know what it is. It also may be some locker room friction, who knows...

I'm VERY concerned about Tonyan. On those little swing passes, he'll catch the ball, turn up field, and when he starts to run it looks like he's running in 7 inches of mud! There's no burst, NOTHING. Not to mention he's pretty easy to tackle right now as Al mentioned.

On Sunday the Packers are playing another team with a limited WR Corps. Golladay has been a complete bust as a FA. Shepard is out for the year. Even if Daniel Jones plays on one leg, or Davis Webb suits up, this is a team that is built around Barkley. MAKE the QB beat you. Trust Rasol and Stokes to be able to win their match-ups and STOP Barkley. I swear if Barkley runs for 170 yards and there are 2 safeties back the entire game...AGAIN, then Barry should be left IN London. This is a game I'm actually concerned about. It may be 2:30 PM at KO in London, but it's 8:30 AM for EVERY Packer player and coach. That's pretty damn early for Football. The only thing that makes me a little happier is it's 7:30 AM for the Giants!! Well that and by about 9:30 AM on Sunday (Pacific Time), I'll have the WHOLE day to do other things after watching the Packers hopefully win.

Ford has a better idea. I really hope that our recent STs' successes aren't the product of one player. People get hurt all year. Let's get some Mopars warmed up too.

Torture - It would have been torture if they lost!! But let’s not forget. In 2010 we were 10 -6!
Belichick - Double team Clark! And see who steps up.
Shades of MM- It’s a state of mind thing. As long as he’s are qb. He’s not blowing smoke up are ass.
Tonyan worries- The TE position needs more support!
The Barry Story- Injuries. Finding the right replacements. And confidence. Walker is improving.
kicking-Crosby doesn’t have the leg anymore. Wishing and keeping your fingers crossed won’t change that.
Consistency- Tom Brady has had his problems with new WRs too. And is the defense following the footsteps of Kevin King ?
Ford is playing his way to a bigger roll.
My virgin ears- Rodgers 4 letter word to hike the ball was priceless!

Why must they torture us? -
I do think something Rodgers said yesterday is very accurate. That GB is always going to get everyones best shot. Also how many blow out losses has Belichek had under his belt?
While we went to OT and my blood pressure was very high, these types of games can be very good for the team. A team full of young players.

The Belichick factor -
He simply is the best coach in football. There are some very good ones, but he is the best.

Shades of MM -
I mean neither were wrong.

Tonyan worries -
I think its something that will take time for him to regain the explosiveness. Hopefully each week he starts to trust his knee more and each week he can keep producing.

What's the Story Barry? -
I don't get what they were trying to do. It sounded like LaFleur felt the same way too. That they were playing way to soft yet again. I don't get when they have a 3rd string QB and they know the other team was going to run, why they didn't load the box to stop the run. I just don't get the philosophy.

Davis Webb -
Regardless of who the QB is, expect a lot of running with Barkley. Hopefully they start defending the run better!

Kicking it Off -
I don't think Crosby has the leg to routinely get the ball into the endzone. That being said, his FG's have been perfectly straight. His kicks have been looking so damn good. I'm not worried about kickoffs.

Consistently inconsistent -
There are a lot of young talented players on this team. Once some of them start figuring things out they will gain the consistency we want to see.

This is your punt coverage with Rudy Ford:
Ford has been a huge asset as a returner. I am sure he wants to play on defense and he did really well actually. But, we need him on special teams. He is such a good gunner. Best we have had since Janis.

My hunch pre season was this would be Rodgers worst year of his career. So far I'm right on. I based on him being more concerned about his passer rating and per completion then trying to win. He almost ignores our newbies because he doesnt think they can catch footballs.
Thus, problem 1, were only using a handful of people in the offense.
2. We drafted a number one pick who cant make the field. OUr number three pick cant hold on to footballs. Our first round pick Stokes still looks lost and is not a cover corner by any strech. Amos is hurt gain, Jairre is hurt again and we still have a raft of old war horse tight ends who werent that great when they were young.
Bottom line this aint a talented team. Lucky were playing crippled teams and poor teams right now. The one good team we played kicked out ass. Time to accept that and quit wondering whats wrong

Al, Since while watching live I felt I’d give the coaches a disservice of an opinion, yesterday I mapped out every defensive play by using All-22, I think Barry needs some defending from the thoughts he doesn’t stack the box or make adjustments.

Of course, any of us might have a different definition of a light vs heavy box. In this description, I don’t include a pressing CB as in the Box, but I do include the safety within 5 yards of the LOS. Obviously, the CB is there to cover the WR.

Also, I’m using 6 men as light (2DL), 7 men- Base (3DL) and 8 men as very aggressive basically heavy while playing Cover 1, meaning only 1 safety back.

There were 55 defensive plays, not including the 4th down punts.
15 - 6 Men or light
29 - 7 men or base ( a few times they played cover 1 with 2DL and safety in the box.
15 - 8 men or heavy

Of course, there is more to it than just that. When playing light what was the situation. IE: if it is an obvious passing situation, you play coverage or light in the box to cover 4 wide, which NE played a lot of to spread GB out. So, taking out all of the obvious passing situations from the light box we have 5 plays that I’ll call Barry playing light box. Below are the results of the light box.
4th series - 3rd and 2. Run for a 1st down
6th series - 1st & 10 on GB 22yd line. Sack fumble GB recovers (blitz)
7th series - 2nd & 5on GB 31 yd line. Run for 1st down
8th series - this is a NE TD . 1st & 10 on NE 34 yd line. 13 yd run ( from this point on in this drive he played 3DL and He played 8M twice, once as Cover 1 and was burned for a 24 yd pass that set up the TD) This was to counter Belichick using a 6th blocking OL and only 2W. Where most of the game he was 3 or 4 W to keep the Packers from always loading the box.
10th series and last in regulation - 3rd and 3 from GB 9 yd line they ran and GB held them short.

In the OT, Barry loaded up the box with 8 men on 1st and 10 and 2nd & 5, then on 3rd and 6 he lined up 6Men and blitzed with pressure coverage.

On a big picture viewpoint. My thoughts are Barry made adjustments and played a heavy box frequently during the game. Two of the biggest plays for NE is when Barry became very aggressive with 8 men box, playing cover 1. Also, some of the biggest plays is when he went light with 6 men box, 2 DL and applied or showed pressure.

You can draw your own conclusion, but saying he didn’t play a heavy box is just incorrect and unfair to Barry. Lastly, one of the better defenses last year was Buffalo and as you stated above Al, Buffalo couldn’t stop NE from running the ball for a whole game. Sometimes its the players, not the coaches and the other team is also good.

A minor rebuttal from me. One, in the world of sports premadonna’s Aaron Rodgers is not one of them. Every single thing he says is parsed and dissected. And often what he says is true.

Two, all defensive coordinators are going to the defense that Barry runs. Should he adjust? Yes, but with the backups playing DB’s that could create larger problems.

Third, maybe we are expecting too much from players returning from major surgeries.

Fourth, the receivers are young and inexperienced. But they have potential and are coming along.

Last, we have new coaches and are feeling their way and the results will be inconsistent..

Given the above, of course they will struggle. Yet I expect that the team will grow as the season goes along.

Fall colors are here, the weather is great and we're all sitting here worrying about Robert Tonyan.

Sorry for all the types who like to be worried, but the Packers are 3-1 and I'm going to enjoy fall.

Another good piece Al, and thanks for the clips on the punt coverage. Ford has been a big help though others need to make plays. This is the 4th season for LaFleur, and its time he makes adjustments. Packers need to start out fast for once and get a good lead. They seem to play to the level of the opponent, and they left many points out there against the Patriots. This is such a league of parity now and a couple of plays makes the difference between a win or loss. On paper, the roster looks solid. Let's hope the coaches can call schemes to utilize those players best abilities.

As far as Rodgers goes, it seems there is a disconnect between the coach and QB. Thus, the tendency to throw long passes on first down that never, ever connect. What to do about it? Grit your teeth and put up with it. As far as Tonyan is concerned, he's coming back from a knee injury, and is playing a position that requires him to put a lot of pressure on that knee to be successful. It seems he's heading toward another "prove it" year next year, when the knee, and Tonyan's confidence in it, should be back. Finally, the defense was being praised all off-season as being the greatest thing since sliced bread. Yet, they show some maddening tendencies. Like allowing Jefferson to be uncovered for much of the first game. And the puzzling decisions either not focus on shutting down the run, or the defense being unable to stop the run. Is it time to pay for a first-rate defensive coach? Or was the defense simply overhyped?

"Finally, the defense was being praised all off-season as being the greatest thing since sliced bread. Yet, they show some maddening tendencies."

I think it was a huge overreaction to the SF playoff game. What's never mentioned are the horrible weather conditions that game was played under:

"Temperatures are expected to dip into the teens well before the NFC divisional game kicks off at 7:15 p.m. at Lambeau Field, with wind chills near zero, according to Scott Berschback, a meteorologist with the National Weather Service in Green Bay.
Daytime temperatures, with highs expected to be in the lower 20s, will be accompanied by winds from the west between 10 and 20 mph throughout the day. By the evening, the temperatures will drop into the lower teens, with winds from the northwest around the same speed and the occasional 20 mph gusts. "

That weather, more than any great defensive effort, held both offenses below what would have been expected otherwise. And I fear many got a false sense of security about the defense as a result.

On the second punt return video, isn't that Ford getting blocked about 10 yards in front of the returner before he catches it??
Tight end has become our white whale... we just can't find a solution there.

I noticed the impact of the absence of Ford too. On the other hand it was a big plus seeing him fare pretty well on D in relief of Amos, probably a bigger one. Perhaps the new ILB will help ST depth too.

As far as I’m concerned, the D isn’t perfect. BB gave our ILBs fits. He’s very good at that (he also tends to have very good STs). However, I don’t see the D or Barry as a dumpster fire as some do. I do think that they are short a true run stuffer on the DL. Reed is better disrupting (and had a good game), so is Slaton. The other piece is Lowry, who is and always has been a liability in the run game. That’s not a balanced make up. I’d really like to see Hefflin promoted to take snaps from Lowry against run focused teams.

On O we are at war with our own roster. Lazard is a good piece, Cobb contributes as long as we don’t over use him, but the play making talent resides primarily with rookies. That was never an obviously great combination with Rodgers or LaFleur, but it seems that the chosen approach is to just continue as before. That’s not going to work.

The Watkins gamble is on hold, and his history suggests it may be over in meaningful terms. Doubs’ use is sporadic. In reality you want to get receivers involved and keep them involved, particularly rookies. Watson is 50 yards or a gadget and Toure isn’t even seeing the field. We seldom have more than one source of speed or explosion on the field and more than 29 yards from the line of scrimmage.

To compound that, most of the passes and routes (importantly) occupy the short field that our RBs cause to be crowded. This puts more pressure on our O line, makes it harder to get players open and fails to capitalize on Jones. When we do try to break out it’s often to Cobb and Lazard. Cobb is great at finding space, but he’s not fast and neither Is Lazard. Also, neither are going to be getting a lot better from playing time. They are now what they will be in December if healthy.

We saw what Love could do with Doubs and Toure in preseason and the routes they ran. It’s pretty ridiculous to think Rodgers couldn’t do as much and more. I find it interesting that no one has noted that Watson caught a 24 yarder in 5 (?) passes thrown by Love, but has had no similar route or target since. Instead we see actual or near handoffs or flat throws for the vast majority of the time. We’ve seen very few mid level routes called. We trot out 2 RBs, but their targeting in the passing game is limited. We don’t run plays that put speed on The field in multiple locations and don’t pair it up to stress Ds.

In short we aren’t using our potential difference makers and we aren’t trying to put them in the positions that have the greatest chance of success typically given the defenses we’ve faced. We are playing to our opponents not trying to play to our upside and we aren’t doing much to accelerate learning. This O is not talented enough to use Doubs, Watson and Toure this way and expect to contend. Lazard and Cobb aren’t, and never were, going to carry this O to a Super Bowl, even if Jones stayed healthy.

I was waiting to see how LaFleur approached this season with the roster we have. It was a chance in my view to show that, as a HC, he could lead this team to try and harness its talent even though that would mean playing and developing rookies at an accelerated rate but give us a chance to succeed after Rodgers’ returned post Adams and MVS.

In reality, I see no coherent plan beyond reluctant use of Doubs and gadgetry with Watson. I see a team trying to play Adams ball with Lazard and Cobb interspersed with ultra timid use of Doubs and Watson with rare (3 in 4 games) ultra low percentage long shots

I get the desire not to look at it this way, but the reality is that LaFleur is as bankrupt in terms of season strategy as he is with respect to game day. Rodgers may be a factor, but he doesn’t call the plays or send on the players and, ultimately, he’s LaFleur’s responsibility. LaFleur very volubly wanted him back. So it’s on LaFleur regardless.

The reality is that LaFleur is timid in terms of personnel and overall play calling and not imaginative. This roster and particularly this O was never going to function by not taking in the challenge of adapting to roster realities. Instead we have ultra conservative hope and the inevitable results. LaFleur is a bust. He will probably be after Rodgers. Incredibly as I find it to say this, we might be doing just as well without Rodgers now, if that led to us using our skill players more naturally.

Without a major change in attitude, this team isn’t beating a good team that’s at least relatively healthy. That’s true even if this D plays lights out. The reality is that we don’t have a Coach with a vision and the ability to marry this roster with game plans or a season one.

We may not have Rodgers next year or the year after, we will have LaFleur, and that ought to be a chilling thought. More and more I’m convinced that LaFleur is the reason Rodgers never wins that second Super Bowl. This season is showing with even more clarity why we’ve had 2, if not 3, flame outs under LaFleur. He’s not a leader, an innovator or tactically adept.

I wonder if the passivity from Pettine (who was aggressive on arrival at first) aren’t partly a result if the influence of LaFleur’s personality away from the cameras. Certainly, LaFleur and recently Rodgers have started to sound more and more like MM at the end of his tenure when he had run out of ideas and knew it.

Barry needs to be more adaptable as a DC. I don't care what his "philosophy" is, just please do whatever gives the defense the greatest advantage against the opposition and please be able to adapt in-game. That is what good defensive coordinators do. We have seen more man over the past couple of weeks, which is good (more man is great because we have the personnel to carry it out), but I would like more blitzing, maybe bring in the ILBs, Safeties, and CBs occasionally. However, I think we're not appreciating the job Barry's done so far. The Packers are tied with the Cowboys for the third-best scoring defense, they have the #7 overall defense, the #3 passing defense, and the #1 third-down defense. There is still lots of room for improvement (what I said above, #22 run defense), but he has been decently good.

I'm not as worried by the run defense as some, I just think they need to be more consistent. They've shown they can be good, as we saw for part of the NE and CHI games and all of the TB game, they just need to do that consistently. Other than Saquon Barkely, the Packers own every matchup against the Giants.

I'm surprised by the lack of INTs. I think the Packers need to move Douglas outside permanently, as he doesn't have the profile of a nickel CB. Maybe as they get more flexible, more INTs will happen, but playing against the Giants' 3rd string QB presents a good chance for our DBs. They also need to work on their hands, too (there was a dropped INT by Douglas vs NE near the end of the game).

Lowry needs to play better against the run. He is looking like the Lowry of old. I'm starting to think we trade him, maybe with a mid-draft pick, for a better defensive lineman, maybe Daron Payne of the Commanders? There've been trade rumors about him.

As far as TE, I'd like to see Deguara become involved in the passing game. I know he's more of a FB, but he is another option.

If Amos misses a decent amount of time, I think we could consider signing a veteran, like Anthony Harris or Jaquiski Tartt. However, I'd like them to elevate Abernathy first and see what he can do; I was very impressed by him in the preseason, not just with his ball skills but his abilities in coverage.

On the Tonyan issue, I've been yammering about that since before he was even hurt. People want him to "get back to normal." and I get that. But my fear has always been that his one good year was not "normal." I think it was quite abnormal, and I doubt he would ever have gotten back to that level of production and efficiency even if he had never been injured. In a nutshell, I think he's a nice player, but there is no way I would consider him a top ranked TE in the league on the level of Travis Kelce, George Kittle, Mark Andrews, or Darren Waller. I don't think it's even close.

If normal means producing like he did in 2020, that was never going to happen, IMO. He certainly didn't look special before he got hurt in 2021.

People have been concerned about the Packers throwing short so much, and I get that. I think one of the problems is that the Packers basically have no credible threat from the TE position to attack the deep middle.

That's a pretty stark contrast with and without Ford; I don't think we can afford to pull him off STs. Maybe this isn't a bad time to call up Abernathy for a look see since the Giants receivers aren't much of a threat. If he proves ineffective, they can always go back to Ford.

The 49ers play their base 4-3 ad nauseum and yet you NEVER see them getting beat over the top. They control the line of scrimmage first and play coverage second. And their secondary isnt even in the same ballpark as this Packers secondary. Why is this coaching staff (on both sides of the ball) so damn afraid to play a physical style of football? Have some f****** balls ffs.